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Groupsets Conundrum

I am going to be building up a bike for my other half using a spare frame and I was wanting to get peoples thoughts on groupsets.

My current options are as follows:

New Shimano 105 (5800) 2x11 speed - This is exactly the same as on my bike so would mean I only have to consider spare parts for one type of groupset. I would use an 11-32 cassette here.

Old Shimano Utegra triple (6500) 3x9 speed - This may enable her to more easily do the larger inclines when we do tours but spares are becoming rarer. I would use a 12-25 cassette here

Thoughts?

If you're new please join in and if you have questions pop them below and the forum regulars will answer as best we can.

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24 comments

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Simontuck | 8 years ago
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2x11 with a compact crankset and the correct derraileur to fit a 32 at the back. Job done.

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matthewn5 | 8 years ago
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Put the shiny new group on it. My other half doesn't like used stuff - yours may differ of course. But it will be more special if it's brand new.

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harman_mogul | 8 years ago
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2x11 Shimano every time. Even tho I have a triple setup on my winter bike! Alfine hub gear with electronic shfting not so bad either...

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Roadie_john | 8 years ago
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Unless you're deliberately building something retro or getting the 9s kit for free, go for the 105. It'll work at least as well, if not better, for the lack of wear, spares will be easier to find and cheaper/not half worn already. 105 is good quality kit. 5800 probably works better than 6500 did. My 4700 is on a par with the 6500 I used to have on my race bike, and was much easier to set up to boot.

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Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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I'm stumped by these comments.

I've got short legs for my height. I have two triples which have different chainring combos and different crank arms.

I've never felt any discomfort over a two ring set up.

Do I need shorter legs to feel this mystical uncomfortable weirdness?

What gear ratios were uncomfortable? What cadence? What crank lengths were being used? Just how short are the legs involved? Where was the discomfort? Did the others dimensions of the bike fit?

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Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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Sorry V, I need to argue the point on chains.

Chains used on triples are every bit as long-lived as any other once you appreciate that the facility to cross chain in a triple setup is greater than in a double.

For 9 speed - If you run the big ring with the smallest 5/6 sprockets and the granny with the biggest 5/6 you won't kill a chain any faster. You also have use of all sprockets with the middle ring.

I have a Campag Record triple which has been running the same chain for at least 5000 miles.

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Vejnemojnen | 8 years ago
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i would not put a triple chainset on, because they are too wide, very uncomfortable and feel funny when pedalling.

 

not to mention, that the 9spd chains are not as durable, esp. with the chainlines of a triple.

 

and the 9spd shimano groups of the octalink era were tend to wear out kinda fast (5500-6500-4400 etc)

 

get the 11

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Tjuice replied to Vejnemojnen | 8 years ago
1 like

Vejnemojnen wrote:

i would not put a triple chainset on, because they are too wide, very uncomfortable and feel funny when pedalling.

They are??!

I ride single, double and used to have a triple on a now retired bike, and never found any of them uncomfortable and funny-feeling!

That said, if building up from 'new' / buying the parts, I would not buy a triple.  But if you have the triple groupset lying around the house already, then there is not harm in building up the bike with that in the first instance and see how the other half gets on.  And then change the groupset in due course when you both feel like upgrading.

[As it happens, I am building a bike for my other half using mostly parts that I have around the house, including a triple.  If she gets into it (today she much prefers running), we'll buy her a new bike]

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Welsh boy replied to Tjuice | 8 years ago
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Tjuice wrote:

Vejnemojnen wrote:

i would not put a triple chainset on, because they are too wide, very uncomfortable and feel funny when pedalling.

They are??!

I ride single, double and used to have a triple on a now retired bike, and never found any of them uncomfortable and funny-feeling!

That said, if building up from 'new' / buying the parts, I would not buy a triple.  But if you have the triple groupset lying around the house already, then there is not harm in building up the bike with that in the first instance and see how the other half gets on.  And then change the groupset in due course when you both feel like upgrading.

[As it happens, I am building a bike for my other half using mostly parts that I have around the house, including a triple.  If she gets into it (today she much prefers running), we'll buy her a new bike]

 

They are uncomfortable if you have short legs.  Never having had long legs I cant say if they are better with long limbs but as a short legged person I would never use a triple again

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fukawitribe replied to Welsh boy | 8 years ago
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Welsh boy wrote:

They are uncomfortable if you have short legs.  Never having had long legs I cant say if they are better with long limbs but as a short legged person I would never use a triple again

Eh ? I have short legs and never suffered on my old triple because it wasn't a double or single ring. Crank arms that were too long or noticeable Q-factor issues maybe, but not the tiny difference between a 2 and 3 ring crank. What is it that you think is making them inherently uncomfortable - Q-factor presumably (given there's nothing else..) ?

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ClubSmed | 8 years ago
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Thanks everyone, looks like I'm going for the compact 105 then

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racingcondor | 8 years ago
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Derailleurs wear out around the pins which gives you sloppy shifting and becomes a pain to set up. I'd steer clear of the 6500 unless you know it's done a very low mileage.

Another vote for the 105 here

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Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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In that case, I'd get the compact.

I took my commuter on a business trip earlier this week... 15 miles on rolling terrain with a couple of short steepish hills from station to hotel and then 3 miles to site. Laptop, stationery, assorted phones chargers and connections, two full sets of clothes Inc shoes plus cycling kit. All in, about 20kg of extra weight.
Did this on a compact with a 32t out back and was only on the small chainring a couple of times. I may have been guilty of crossing my chain on several more occasions though...

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Rod Marton | 8 years ago
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I used to be a fan of triples, but nowadays with compact chainsets and large numbers of sprockets on the cassette it isn't so clear cut. The remaining advantages of triples are that the jump in gearing on the front changer isn't so large and the smaller number of sprockets means that the chain is more robust (that one's a bit marginal unless you are planning on expedition touring in the middle of nowhere). The advantage of a compact double is that it is easier to keep so a sensible chain line. I would definitely use a triple for expedition touring or tandem, definitely a double for racing, but for general use either will do.

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Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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I run a Campag triple on a couple of bikes and at 30-29 can ride up anything. I do agree though that there is some duplication and a couple of less than sweet spots in a triple set up. Not enough to bother me even over a few thousand miles a year between the two bikes.

If you got both of those groupsets lying around I'd fit the compact 11 speed with little reservation.
However, if you're still to buy that but have the triple "in stock" I'd just fit that instead. Unless it's for racing, I wouldn't write off a 9 speed triple as its still able to cover almost any Terrain and parts will still be available for a good while yet. (Get a cassette with a wider range though).

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ClubSmed replied to Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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CXR94Di2 wrote:

Is this bike your building having drops or flat handlebars? Flat bars will allow mtb shifters/ rear derailleur with the ability to fit up to 42t rear cass. I fitted a Shimano slx groupset to my wife's shopper(don't ask). 38/22 crank 11-36t cass. It goes anywhere and she no longer has to get off and push. Though it would be quicker on some steep hills:)

It will have drops so I think such a large rear cassette is out of the question unfortunately

 

Jack Osbourne snr wrote:

I run a Campag triple on a couple of bikes and at 30-29 can ride up anything. I do agree though that there is some duplication and a couple of less than sweet spots in a triple set up. Not enough to bother me even over a few thousand miles a year between the two bikes. If you got both of those groupsets lying around I'd fit the compact 11 speed with little reservation. However, if you're still to buy that but have the triple "in stock" I'd just fit that instead. Unless it's for racing, I wouldn't write off a 9 speed triple as its still able to cover almost any Terrain and parts will still be available for a good while yet. (Get a cassette with a wider range though).

I do not have either of these as of yet. The triple I would be buying second hand and the 105 I would be getting new, as I would be using the Cycle to Work scheme to purchase the 105 there is not too much difference in real cost.

 

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. . replied to ClubSmed | 8 years ago
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ClubSmed wrote:

It will have drops so I think such a large rear cassette is out of the question unfortunately

Have you consider Tiagra?  That could give you 34/34

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maviczap replied to . . | 8 years ago
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. . wrote:

ClubSmed wrote:

It will have drops so I think such a large rear cassette is out of the question unfortunately

Have you consider Tiagra?  That could give you 34/34

If not do what i did and swap the front to a 33 and run a 32 - 12. 105 long cage will work easily with the 32.

33 is the smallest front chainring you can get for a compact chainset i think.

 

 

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CXR94Di2 | 8 years ago
1 like

Is this bike your building having drops or flat handlebars?

Flat bars will allow mtb shifters/ rear derailleur with the ability to fit up to 42t rear cass. I fitted a Shimano slx groupset to my wife's shopper(don't ask). 38/22 crank 11-36t cass. It goes anywhere and she no longer has to get off and push. Though it would be quicker on some steep hills:)

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Dnnnnnn | 8 years ago
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I'd go 2X11 too. Plenty scope for low gears without big gaps there.

You don't say how gear-savvy your other half is but lots of people really don't understand how to use their gears properly, and triples just exaccerbate that.

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Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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A 25t sprocket with a triple is a waste of time. I'd put as big as you can on the back.

Is Shimano 9 speed not good for up to 30t at the back?

What spares are you finding hard to acquire? I get Ultegra 9 speed might be getting rarer, but plenty of Shimano or Shimano compatible parts still in manufacture.

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ClubSmed replied to Jack Osbourne snr | 8 years ago
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Jack Osbourne snr wrote:

A 25t sprocket with a triple is a waste of time. I'd put as big as you can on the back. Is Shimano 9 speed not good for up to 30t at the back? What spares are you finding hard to acquire? I get Ultegra 9 speed might be getting rarer, but plenty of Shimano or Shimano compatible parts still in manufacture.

25t cog is just what would come with it. To be honest I have not looked for Ultegra 9 speed parts, it was just an assumption which looks like it was wrong. Thanks for putting me straight.

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I am a human | 8 years ago
4 likes

I had a 3x8 on one of my bikes, and 11s 105 with 11-32 on the other one.  Given the choice I'd go for 105 every time.  I prefer 2x11 a lot more just because there's a lot less front shifting and faffing around to find the right combination of cadence and chain angle.

I've now binned off the 3x8 and put 2x10 Tiagra on that bike, and don't regret it one bit!  Also 34/32 is a spinnier gear than the 30/25 that was the smallest gear on the triple, so it's even better for steep stuff.

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ClubSmed replied to I am a human | 8 years ago
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I am a human wrote:

I had a 3x8 on one of my bikes, and 11s 105 with 11-32 on the other one.  Given the choice I'd go for 105 every time.  I prefer 2x11 a lot more just because there's a lot less front shifting and faffing around to find the right combination of cadence and chain angle.

I've now binned off the 3x8 and put 2x10 Tiagra on that bike, and don't regret it one bit!  Also 34/32 is a spinnier gear than the 30/25 that was the smallest gear on the triple, so it's even better for steep stuff.

 

Thank you, that is just what I needed to hear

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