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TECH NEWS
Video: A detailed look at Pinarello’s new Dogma K8-S suspension road bike
A little while ago, before Paris-Roubaix, Pinarello unveiled its latest creation, the Dogma K8-S, which brought back soft tail technology not seen since the 90s and wrapped it up in a frame based on the regular Dogma F8 as ridden by Team Sky.
In this video that has just been released, Pinarello provides a very detailed explanation of the inner workings of the suspension component of the new frame, and its testing and manufacturing development. Pinarello reckon the new bike can bolster performance over rough terrain by 4.6 per cent, and improve rider comfort by as much as 50 per cent.
“Today, our knowledge of carbon fibre, and in partnership with Jaguar, has allowed us to introduce the first lightweight full suspension road bike,” says Pinarello’s Fausto Pinarello at the beginning of the video.
The key part of the new K8-S is the small suspension unit located at the top of the seat stays. It’s composed of two parts, a piston and an elastomer bumper, which dampens the vibrations. The elastomer can be swapped out for a softer or firmer type depending on rider weight. There are also ferrules at the top of the main unit which can be used preload the elastomer to make it firmer if needed.
Elastomers were commonplace on early mountain bike suspension forks, before air and coil dampers developed enough to make elastomers a thing of the past. A good thing because in those early applications, they weren't much cop, and were affected by temperature and didn't provide much in the way of damping.
There are no pivots in the frame. Instead, Pinarello has developed chain stays that are much flatter and wider towards the dropouts, and seat stays with a double curvature, that together provide the necessary vertical deflection for the suspension to work.
The concept isn’t a new one. The idea of flexible carbon fibre stays was used quite widely on early mountain bikes, with companies like Trek and Cannnondale both at one point offering soft tail mountain bikes. There were a few road versions, most famously Trek's brief flirtation with a soft tail race bike for the Discovery team, but that ended soon after George Hincapie's ill-fated Paris-Roubaix, when the steerer tube on his bike snapped.
Pinarello recognises the idea isn’t a new one, but the Italian reckons no one has been able to package the technology into a road bike while maintaining all the essential stiffness, weight and handling credentials of a regular race bike, in the way it has managed.
That’s not all. Pinarello has also developed a new seatpost. It mirrors the aerodynamic shape of the regular Dogma F8’s seat post with the same aero cross-section, but has a modified shape that it claims provides 40% more absorption of vertical forces.
To test the bike, Pinarello developed a testing rig that simulates riding over cobblestones at pro race speed to put the new frame through its paces.
Bikes that provide comfort over long distances are big business at the moment, with most manufacturers now offering an endurance/sportive road bike that aims to offer extra comfort over a regular race bike. A few sport some sort of damping unit, whether it's the cutaway Zertz approach used by Specialized or the IsoSpeed decoupler of Trek's Domane.
Read more - Buyers guide: 2015 sportive and endurance road bikes +13 of the Best
David worked on the road.cc tech team from 2012-2020. Previously he was editor of Bikemagic.com and before that staff writer at RCUK. He's a seasoned cyclist of all disciplines, from road to mountain biking, touring to cyclo-cross, he only wishes he had time to ride them all. He's mildly competitive, though he'll never admit it, and is a frequent road racer but is too lazy to do really well. He currently resides in the Cotswolds, and you can now find him over on his own YouTube channel David Arthur - Just Ride Bikes.
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28 comments
So funny to read the 'Luddite' comments.
So silly....these technology neophites
Only a matter of time before most all road bikes will have some form of full suspensions, electronically controlled and auto adjusted for conditions. You may even see dropper posts on a road bike. Once technology enables millisecond adjustments on parts, nothing will be out of the realm of possibility. Only cost, which of course eventually levels out. Push bikes will essential become motorbikes- sans the motors.
Now back to bunched panty crowd and their wailing...
LMFAO
how about this? 1901 pierce chainless cushion frame...
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/242701867393511554/
There really are far too many pricks on here...
They know that it isn't a new idea!
It isn't a gimmick, they are hoping that it will make their riders faster on the cobbles.
Personally I'd like to see a comparison with the Infinito CV.
Everyone entitled to their opinion, so I'd stop short of calling people pricks personally (although you are of course entitled to your opinion as well).
My point specifically is they have said, "Today, our knowledge of carbon fibre, and in partnership with Jaguar, has allowed us to introduce the first lightweight full suspension road bike". But it's not the first, is it? And with respect to the bent chainstays and seatstays, you only have to look at Hetchins 'curlies' to see that it's not especially revolutionary either.
As a bike, great. Marketing spiel, I could do without.
So what's the weight difference then? That's probably the key there, they aren't claiming to be the first full suspension road bike but the first lightweight full suspension road bike.
It's a subtle, almost weasely difference, but it's still a difference.
fair play
sure i had something like this on an old MTB back in the 90's only it had a coil wrapped around it like a spring with a bit of rubber inside... did sod all! more marketing tripe to flog expensive bikes made in the far east to mamils
I just wish we had a UCI standard no suspension or disc brakes but simple and hence more rider skill/input.
Nice article/video
Wider tyres, suspension, etc. What next?
Here is a plan:
Perhaps go wider with the tyres and add some knobbles in the mix.
Disc brakes are here but how about a wide bar for more control, I'm thinking coupled with a short stem.
A bit more rear suspension and how about a suspension fork too. Maybe a dropper post?
Hardly new
Moots YBB: 2003 http://www.dreambike.com/vamootstest.htm
And yes, they have already done this 1) for cx bikes and 2) with disc brakes
That's seriously good looking bike, pretty much perfectly decked out. Thanks for the link.
For me the vibration through the bars is way more of an issue than the rear of the bike. Modern endurance frames, carbon seatposts and 28mm tyres do a great job of smoothing out the rough stuff, even the cobbles, but your hands take an absolute beating and somehow that seems all the worse if you the back of the bike is running smoothly!
no disc brakes?
No. Either that or someone's gone to a great deal of trouble with Photoshop.
Not yet, it's been developed for immediate use in UCI races.
Would this have made more sense to introduce to CX first?
With so many ways to introduce and control flex in modern carbon frames, it seems like quite an old technology. And who apart from the pros have to torture themselves putting down race level power on cobblestones.
What on earth do you mean by 'ruins the bike' ? I'm presuming you're on about some personal aesthetic veiw rather than the performance of it. Personally i've never been a fan of the look of Pinarello framesets, until possibly now, but I could give it a bit of leeway if it worked really well.. YMMV clearly ..
...because Pinarello are so really big in CX ?.....
...it is, as everyone - including them - knows and admits
Eh ? That was just testing they were talking about - I really doubt suspension benefits magically disappear when called upon in other circumstances...
What on earth do you mean by 'ruins the bike' ? I'm presuming you're on about some personal aesthetic veiw rather than the performance of it. Personally i've never been a fan of the look of Pinarello framesets, until possibly now, but I could give it a bit of leeway if it worked really well.. YMMV clearly ..
...for whom ?... because Pinarello are so really big in CX ? I personally think it'd be more suited for harder, less irregular, rough surfaces such as cobbles, sets, Sustrans routes..
...it is, as everyone - including them - knows and admits
Eh ? That was just testing they were talking about - I really doubt suspension benefits magically disappear when called upon in other circumstances...[/quote]
[dup]
Shame, the suspension unit isn't pretty and ruins the bike. What have they done at the front end? Ah well, it won't stop the people who splash out on "italian" bikes made in Taiwan. By they way Giant's new Defy claims "comparable" compliance without any "gimmicks". But good on Pinarello for trying something new (- only it isn't).
Wonder if the frame is lifed due to the movement in the chainstays. Should have put another one in the chainstay bottom brkt area just like a 60's moulton
Guess they couldn't be seen to copy Trek, but it's not the minimal solution.
Cannnnondale once did a 'fatty' fork for the road I believe.
Full bounce anyone ?
I love marketing!
What's next? New wheel size for road bikes? Stems with shock absorbers? Inflatable saddles? Drag chute for added safety? Portable anchor?
What indeed. Sadly very few of the "enhancements" proposed are convincing; however that doesn't mean that it's not worth trying.
Takes me back to the neon yellow Girvin Flexstem I had fitted to my MTB for a number of years!
It would be interesting to know what rider weight ranges are anticipated/supported by the different elastomer bumpers.
suspension on road. How exciting.
I'm sure Raleigh used to sell a mountain bike with that technology!