Police operation to educate and advise cyclists and drivers raises questions about police education and advice

Gotta love the part about them "not wanting to blame any particular road user" haven't you.

It would be awful after all to unfairly victimize the particular road users actually partaking in the killing. The indifference and unwillingness to engage is unprecedented isn't it?

Also motor patrol vehicles are the only police vehicles with cameras

Revenue from tickets goes straight to the treasury and not the force. Police forces are woefully understaffed so this type of op is few and far between and can't be carried out on a day basis unfortunately.

You would think, given the revenue generation opportunities, that the police would spend more time stopping trucks.

A concerted push on that and the industry would have to sort itself out... of course, that would upset the Chief Inspector and make him unpopular at his funny-handshake meetings.

Amazing what a short burst of enforcing zero tolerance by the police achieves - 15 tickets out of 70 lorries stopped! Staggering.

If the police could spend some more time enforcing the traffic laws we already have, there would be a swift, albeit painful for some, cultural change on the roads. People sit up when it hurts in the pocket or they may lose some of their freedom.

“There are a lot of bad drivers too, perhaps you should talk to them as they’re the ones doing the killing.”

Harriet Lamb for London Mayor!

I used to work with Eilidh and rode a very similar route Chiswick to Camden. I regularly pass her ghost bike in Notting Hill, a very sobering experience each morning.

Has nothing been learned? Within 100 m of her bike, lorries(M&S), vans and cars all still load and park illegally, causing obstructions and a danger to predestrians and cyclists.

The road was closed for several months by Thames Water with no safe alternative provided.
This route is very congested, despite the congestion zone being removed by the Mayor.

Let us learn from the deaths, not be surprised when another happens because nothing has been done to improve safety on our roads.

They checked 70 lorries and issued penalty notices to 15 of them?

That is a horrifying figure.

The police officers know nothing about the ins and outs of the helmets and hi-viz debates. But they spend all day having helmet chats and then making an enormous noise about it in the media, discouraging cycling on the way but safe from any Boris Attack. Little fines for ASL offenders? What about the 3 points? I bet they never hand out the 3 points fines.

The problem is the idiots with a serious attitude problem who think they own the road. IMHO confiscating vehicles is the way to go. It's the only way to hit rogue commercial operators and company car owners.

so in a random spot check over 20% of the trucks were either defective in some way or the drivers breaking the law on safe driving hours - this is the real headline - remembering that we are talking about the bare legal minimums here

contrast with from recent article credited to Sunday Times
headlined "10% of cyclists ignore red lights" (7% at the London site sampled) and of course only put themselves at danger

simple numbers says where Police priority for action is needed

http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/info/workmobiles.pdf

thought it worth mentioning.

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The Police may check phone records when investigating fatal and serious crashes to determine if use of a phone contributed to the crash. Employers who require staff to use any mobile phone while driving for work could be prosecuted if an investigation determined that such use of the phone contributed to a crash. Claims in the civil courts could also result.

so lets see the corporate manslaughter cases when reps aren't paying attention!!!!!

I guess they'll inform the grieving family of the next unwilling victim of fatal trauma suffered to their pelvis and abdomen having been run-over by a 32-ton tipper truck that at least they were wearing high-vis and a helmet! F*tards

Bring the weight of Health & Safety Legislation to commercial vehicle operators with zero tolerance of accidents and fatalities. New public service contracts to have huge penalties for breaching the conditions - commercial vehicle operators will soon take note when their bottom line is squeezed. It worked in the construction industry to virtually eliminate deaths and serious injury - Boris take note.

In my experience a large portion of the trouble has nothing to do with not being seen. In fact, quite the opposite. I ride up the bus lane up the hill on the A3 just after the Robin Hood roundabout every day. Generally speaking all lanes are stationary with traffic at about half to 3/4 of the way up the hill. Today the driver of a skip lorry decided that I shouldn't be there, he told me so when we exchanged our opinions, despite the sign saying HGVs, Taxi, Buses and Cycles. For the first 100 yards driving inches from my back wheel with his hand on the horn was his chosen pleasure followed by passing me close enough to touch me and finally a quick brake test before he reached the back of the traffic queue. I'm guessing no amount of hi-viz is going to change his behaviour.

I got everything from "you fcuking cyclist think you own the road" to some nonsense about road tax and of course I replied appropriately. But it was only when I reflected on the experience as I rode off that it dawned on me that had he squeezed me a few more inches and had I fallen I'd have likely ended up between the kerb and his wheels and that would have hurt.... At the very least.

Purposely bad cyclist pi55 me off. I see them every day. But the main difference is that a reckless cyclist is only ever likely to kill himself where as a reckless lorry driver could do a whole lot more damage.

I'm not suggesting all drivers are reckless and certainly not suggesting this explains any of the recent deaths. And yes hi-viz can certainly help with genuine didn't see you cases. But Policing is the only solution to people like the skip knobby I came across today.

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Pull the lorry off the road, impound it and have it collected at their expense, fixed and re-tested prior to being allowed back on the road and you might get them to sit up and pay attention.

I agree but unless you're at a motorway services (where there's lots of space and you're not interfering with anyone else) it's almost impossible to do.

This is on Vauxhall Bridge - you stop 10 lorries there and prevent them from any onward travel due to various defects, driver over the hours etc and before you know it, the entire bridge is blocked and you've got traffic chaos.

There's the other factor that if it's carrying livestock or perishables, you've got the welfare of the cargo to think about too. Can't leave it parked up in central London for 6hrs while the company finds another driver, gets him to the scene, makes the onward journey.

Don't get me wrong, I agree with you entirely, the penalties for bad driving are far too lax and should be much higher (and enforced much better). Just pointing out the the logistics of stopping lorries (or even cars) in London are far from simple. Which is why they take the much easier target of stopping cyclists - we don't take up as much room when stopped!

forgets his glasses ... !!! You're kidding me right ??? You're not !
oh for the love of god ......

any car over 3 years old needs an mot. Perhaps it's time we
started testing the cretin behind the wheel on a yearly basis !
If I were to forget my glasses it's likely I'd not find the car let
alone drive it - what a statement to make !

Oh dear. Are we sure this wasn't being filmed as satire? Somebody is going to tell me this all a joke soon. Right?

Jeremy Vine did a piece on how cyclists can protect themselves today, when someone mentioned drivers he said "but you are not going to get drivers to change the way they drive" I was gobsmacked I hate poor driving as a cyclist and as a driver. Simple crack down on road users drivers, cyclists & pedestrians would send a clear message. Simple message to drivers should be 3 points for first offence, 6 points for second, ban for a year for third, no excuses of I need my car to take riddles to the vets once a week! Tough it would make people sit up and pay attention. As for Company vehicles if one of their vehicles kills someone simple head honcho of the company in the dock for Corporate Manslaughter. A few years ago the Army started putting devices in the civilian cars to measure acceleration, cornering braking and was GPS enabled a box on the dash registered green, amber & red LED's more than 2 red LEDS during a journey when it was downloaded and you were called in to explain with the possibility of disciplinary action. All company vehicles should be fitted with them. Time people learnt that car is not God and a driving licence is a privilege and with it comes responsibility.
Having lived in Germany I used to cycle more than use the car because the law and infrastructure enabled me to get places faster and protected me. The roads are there for everyone to use, not just cars, vans & lorries.

As usual too many people on here take the comments too literally and miss the point of what the Operation was really about. As a car driver and cyclist I am happy to take some responsibility for my own and others' well-being whether driving or cycling. Hi-viz clothing works; it's that simple. When driving, cyclists are easier to see so when I'm cycling, it makes sense to don high-viz. The police officer was almost certainly making that point, all be it a bit tongue in cheek! Apportioning blame is pointless for the dead and injured. Might as well say 'it's my right of way and if I die exercising it, then I died being right'!
We will only end vehicle/cycle collisions if the 2 can be separated. That is happening in small ways but will never happen extensively or quickly. Until then, we all share the responsibility of keeping ourselves safe, and making it easier for others to keep us safe as well.

They should shove all these officers onto bikes and (tracking them by GPS to ensure they follow their allotted routes) distribute them over the road system.

The problem is not if the advice is good or not. The problem is that once again the cyclist is supposed to be at fault when squashed by a truck, even if the truck driver is inconsiderate or breaking the law. This is exactly what he means by saying that: that the burden of care and attention is only on the cyclist's side. It says a lot about the mentality of the police and this is reflected by the level of contempt when it comes to chase road crime. He could have just said "You should take the tube" it would have been the same.

15 offences and a total of just £2300 in fines. No wonder the haulage industry just laughs it off.

Pull the lorry off the road, impound it and have it collected at their expense, fixed and re-tested prior to being allowed back on the road and you might get them to sit up and pay attention.

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They don't make the laws that allow poor drivers to continue on roads

No, they fail to enforce the laws, along with the CPS.

So, totally disregarding the fact that Harriet is using lights as required by the HC and using reflective material (better than hi viz) the officer in question suggests that Hi Viz should be worn in case some fecker has forgotten their distance glasses. If they can't see you well lit up and reflected without their glasses. They sure as heck are not going to see you wearing a bright yellow jacket. Maybe the met's finest should randomly stop drivers and carry out a roadside eye test as they are so concerned about blind drivers on the roads.

I agree, going to the point of preparing yourself for blind drivers is ridiculous. That said, the officer is just doing his job and trying to help.. He's following protocol and they're doing this to TRY TO SAVE YOUR LIFE. They don't make the laws that allow poor drivers to continue on roads