Hunt launches new Hill Climb SL Disc wheelset that weighs just 963g

I don't usually reply to pedantic people, but I have owned some Spinergys, Dura Ace and a good few different Mavic wheelsets and others which I can't even remember the brand. And taking all those into consideration, the Hewitts are the best I have had, which is what I did originally put. I have currently got eight pairs of Hewitt wheels on my various bikes, and have owned lots more which were sold when I moved various bikes on. I had issues with the Mavic wheels, the Spinergys were heavy and poorly built, the Dura Ace were just about OK.

Happy now?

Is that enough 'meaningful data' for you?

Do you have any meaningful data to back up this which you posted?

'Personally I think any and all carbon-rimmed wheels are a waste of money for 99% of cyclists who don't need no steenkin' marginal gains.'

(apart from some scuttlebut he heard somewhere then repeated). Correct, I was riding next to the guy who was moaning about his wheels, and I actually replaced the bearings for him.

And what about this gem?

'Personally I try to avoid being a fan in favour of trying alternatives, whilst tending over time to buy more of a brand that's proved worthy.'

Is that not being a fan then? You have just confessed to doing exactly what I do, I favour a brand which has proven worthy. You are full of hot air. A typical troll. You are just being argumentative for the sake of it.

Finally, I have replaced bearings on Hunt wheels for two different people, so have experience working on them, the bearings used are cheap, a world away from the bearings in my Hope hubs.

Biker Phil wrote:

I don't usually reply to pedantic people, but I have owned some Spinergys, Dura Ace and a good few different Mavic wheelsets and others which I can't even remember the brand. And taking all those into consideration, the Hewitts are the best I have had, which is what I did originally put. 

Happy now?

Is that enough 'meaningful data' for you?

Like ole Rendy, you seem to think that I criticised the Hewitt wheels you're such a fan of. I didn't, of course, since I ain't got any myself and know nothing of them.

What I mentioned to you is that your fan mentality about the Hewitts is evident in the way you dissed Hunt wheels as "crap" depsite not having any yourself or any experience of them other than a mate with a poor bearing in a set of Hunts. Such an avid desire to promote what you're a fan of by dissing alternatives despite knowing nowt about them is classic fanboy behaviour, see?

How did the Hunt bearing you mention get that way? Did your mate give you a full history of his usuage, including the milleage, pressure hose washes, riding in the wet and muck or other events which can degrade wheel bearings? Needing bearing replacement after a degree of use is not unusual, you know.

Is this rather vague anecdote sufficient evidence to condemn all Hunt wheels as "crap"? Hardly.

Biker Phil wrote:

Do you have any meaningful data to back up this which you posted?

'Personally I think any and all carbon-rimmed wheels are a waste of money for 99% of cyclists who don't need no steenkin' marginal gains.'

'Personally I try to avoid being a fan in favour of trying alternatives, whilst tending over time to buy more of a brand that's proved worthy.'

Is that not being a fan then? You have just confessed to doing exactly what I do, I favour a brand which has proven worthy. You are full of hot air. A typical troll. You are just being argumentative for the sake of it.

"Personally I think .... just a personal opinion based on having ridden many, many alloy wheels  and finding them (at 1/2 to 1/5th the cost of carbon equivalents) perfectly fine. (Two broken spokes in 60 years of cycling). Buy as many carbon rimmed wheels as you like, though. 

Being a fan. It's short for "fanatic" - the sort of fellow who grows to love a brand, then ignores anything deterimental about it whilst dissing all alternatives about which the fan knows nothing. Ultrasentive about any remark concerning his loved-brand even when the remark is actually not about the brand at all but an alternative. 

Contrast this with a preference and trust in a brand one has a lot of experience with whilst being nevertheless critical of various aspects of it and always considering alternatives that may offer a diferent balance of advantages and disadvantages for one's purposes. And avoiding the emission of a fan-gush.

Internet trolling: throwing out false and unjustified condemnatory opinions about things one knows nothing about, often whislt cclaiming an expertise one doesn't have, just to get a reaction from the more reasonable and rational.

Being argumentative for the sake of it: a normal and productive human mode of discourse for exchanging views, amending views and discovering more information than one had previously.

If you just want to participate in a mutual admiration club or one of those places rather like the golfing 19th hole, where everyone is hail-fellow-and-well-met and agrees with each other about everything .... well, there are Gentlemens Clubs where old soldiers, Tory politicians and other denizens of the reactionary ilk all get together to condemn loadsa stuff, with one voice and one opinion on, oh, everything.  

Biker Phil wrote:

Finally, I have replaced bearings on Hunt wheels for two different people, so have experience working on them, the bearings used are cheap, a world away from the bearings in my Hope hubs.

I hope you used proper techniques. 

If "cheap" means inexpensive, then that might be a positive attribute. After all, it really is the most marginal of marginal gains to gain 0.5 watts less friction from a wheel bearing by spending £200 more on ceramic balls and a fancy label.

What test procedures did you employ to measure the relative merits and demerits of Hope bearings against Hunt bearings? Or did you just look at them through your infallible "engineering" eye? 

Solipsistic. Yup. Enough said. 

Biker Phil wrote:

Solipsistic. Yup. Enough said. 

Hee hee - it's troo. Unlike some who will diss all sorts because a newspap or some gossip told them to, I enjoy the pursuit of better factuals and data lumps so as to form an idea or three that's actually mine and of better quality than fanboygush.

I know you feel bad losing an argument .... but what can you expect when you allow bald opinions of no worth to be installed in yer wee noggin?  

Anyhoo, after you've read that stuff I pointed you at about maintaining and replacing wheel bearings, you'll want to thank me, I know. If you need a list of tools for doing it properly, rather than hitting it with a hammer, just let me know. Oh, and I have a quite long list of interwebbery sellers of bike bearings, of various brands, qualities and prices.

I didn't make them up or just imagine them, honest!

Cugel wrote:

Oh, and I have a quite long list of interwebbery sellers of bike bearings, of various brands, qualities and prices.

Are they as good as your previous example? Your last link for bearing seals didn't actually sell bearing seals.

Cugel wrote:

So, we could look for them with that Google thing, eh? All bearing specialists sell a vast variety of bearing seals as well as the bearings. Here's an example:

https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/All-Oil-Seals/c4747_5571/index.html

mark1a wrote:

Cugel wrote:

Oh, and I have a quite long list of interwebbery sellers of bike bearings, of various brands, qualities and prices.

Are they as good as your previous example? Your last link for bearing seals didn't actually sell bearing seals.

Cugel wrote:

So, we could look for them with that Google thing, eh? All bearing specialists sell a vast variety of bearing seals as well as the bearings. Here's an example:

https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/All-Oil-Seals/c4747_5571/index.html

You seem to have lost the bit I posted about Hunt being ready, willing and able to supply just seals for their wheel bearings if you want some, even though they don't advertise them on the website. But perhaps you've gossiped with BikerPhil and been convinced that they will be "crap" as they aren't from Mr Hewitt?

The oilseal website above certainly sells bearing seals, although possibly not ones for your own wheels. There are numerous other purveyors. Have a Google.

However, as I mentioned before, why not ask your wheel purveyor if they, like Hunt, will supply you such seals? But perhaps, like Philip, you don't believe in maintaining wheel bearings as they should all last forever. 

So, the list of bearing purveyor websites I have is, then, of no interest to you? I wonder if Phil is interested, as he claims to have renewed two Hunt wheel bearings. That begs the question: what with? If not the Hunt EZO bearings (which he regards as "crap" and so surely wouldn't use) how are those replacements better?  Were they Hewitt-made ones? Is there some data demonstrating this "better"?  Perhaps Phil has a crapometer?

I'd also love to know how the old bearings were taken out and the new ones put in.  He might have some lovely bearing tools I don't know about! Or just a hammer.

**********************

I know you want to reduce every thread to a yah-boo fest and, although I'm happy to give you as many return-raspberries as you like, aren't you interested in a few facts about wheel bearing, their seals, their qualities, their maintenance and so forth? But perhaps you're enjoying being a BikerPhil "It's crap if I have something else" fan instead?

You could try drinking coffee or tea instead of that glass of vitriol for breakfast.

I've got better tools than you'll ever have, and the knowledge how to use them too. 

Biker Phil wrote:

I've got better tools than you'll ever have, and the knowledge how to use them too. 

I have a friend just like you. He's a knob too who thinks he's always correct, but invariably shows himself up.

And there you go again making things up. I recall never saying all wheels are crap except the ones I like. There's absolutely no need to be such a knob with people. 

Your talk of knobs and better tools is just too exciting. Well, for you perhaps.  There could be a Cugel-Phil tool comparison to see who has the biggest best tool but this is risking rudeness, which I would never do, as you know.

Would you like to tell me, though, that all my tools are crap if the brand is not the same as that of your own items? Go on, go on, go on - you know you want to.   

Oh, by the way, you missed my request for details of various things, namely:

* What bearings did you use to replace those "crap" Hunt EZO bearings when you "engineered" a fix to your mates wheels? Not more EZOs surely!?

* Which tools and techniques do you use to take out wheel bearings and put new ones in? I might learn some "engineering" from you if you tellus.

* Does Mr Hewitt design and make his own rims, spokes and hubs, including the bearings? I had a look at his website but, strangely, it doesn't give any details of what's in his custom wheels or how much they cost. As you tell us all that the Hewitts will be not just better than Hunts and everything else but also cheaper for the same sort of thing, it would be interesting to know the details.

TBH each of you is coming across as a bit of a 'tool' in this thread.

Perhaps it's time to call it quits and agree to disagree? Maybe take a slow breath and get a life.

Simon E wrote:

TBH each of you is coming across as a bit of a 'tool' in this thread.

Perhaps it's time to call it quits and agree to disagree? Maybe take a slow breath and get a life.

I fail to see why yahing and booing should be mocked! It's the standard mode in this forum! 

But you may be right. I will be a good boy.

Yet I'd still like Phil to give answers to the questions I put to him concerning his tools & techniques for replacing wheel bearings; and (since he mentioned that his tools were "better") what tools he recommends and why.

It would be also good to know more from Phil about Hewitt wheels, since the Hewitt website gives no information at all about them. Why are they the best Phil has ever used, other than because he likes them and hasn't had one fail? (I have all sorts of wheels and other things that have those characteristics. It means little).

Are Hewitt wheels faster, stronger, less expensive than similar wheels from others and how are these betterments measured and compared? Phil gives no parameters or data at all although he claims this is the case. Let's hear of the parameters and their relative values across various wheelsets.

Buying different wheels for a bike is a possibly one of the first major upgrades many of us make to a complete-bike purchase, since so many bikes are sold with rather poor wheels. We can use manufacturer adverts and PR to compare alternative wheels but this is hardly the best method of comaprison.

Sadly, cycling website reviews generally don't actually measure wheel behaviours either in anything other than an, "I rode them and liked / didn't like them" way. Unless the differences are very large, it can be impossible to compare wheelsets by going for a ride, since the rider is not a precise measuring device and every ride can have a dozen other factors that vary ride to ride to ride, from weather to the internal gurgles and gushes of the cyclist's biological gubbins.

**********

Whilst I personally think the wheels that are the subject of this review are rather a "niche of the niche" product that seem to offer small utility (but something of the opposite, given their probable fragility and olde fashioned tyre tech) even to annual hill climbists, for a lot of money, this doesn't mean that all Hunt wheels (or even these ones) are "crap". That's just an unthinking and uninformed prejudice.

I have a friend just like you. He's a knob too who thinks he's always correct, but invariably shows himself up. 

Tools. I like it. Very subtle.

I have had a set of Mason X Hunt 4 Seasons on my winter bike for a few years now and no complaints here. They are relatively cheap and cheerful but they do the job and are robust and fairly lightweight.

You were luckier than me sir.  My rear rim fell to pieces after an easy eighteen months and I have replaced three noisy bearings over three years of dry riding.

That notable engineer Hambini once referred to Hunt wheels as 'overpriced junk' and, while this is harsh, it is true that my DT Swiss and Fulcrum hoops seem to be of much better quality. 

mike the bike wrote:

You were luckier than me sir.  My rear rim fell to pieces after an easy eighteen months and I have replaced three noisy bearings over three years of dry riding.

That notable engineer Hambini once referred to Hunt wheels as 'overpriced junk' and, while this is harsh, it is true that my DT Swiss and Fulcrum hoops seem to be of much better quality. 

How does a rim fall to pieces?  Especially if it had "an easy" eighteen months? I've never seen a broken rim except if crashed or ridden over that big concrete kerb at 20mph (or even 15). Do you mean the wheel disassembled itself somehow?

Did you not moan-on at Hunt and get them to fix the thing? They boast that they care about the likes o' you, breaking their nice wheels, and will fix things. Is it not so? 

They've sent me a new freehub body for nowt, in the past, when I couldn't get the lockring to stay put on me new Hunt rear wheel.  It turned out I was using the wrong lockring. I've still got the spare freehub, 7 years later.

I enjoy the Hambini lad, apart from a certain inclination to emit a prejudice in a foul-mouthed way, about things he's taken agin' .....  but no evidence given. He did intimate that he would be reaming or roasting (perhaps both) Hunt wheels but so far has just shown how to replace a bearing on one. I'm looking forward to it, the ream or roast!

I have three sets of DT wheels of various kinds, all of which are good - but no better or worse than the two sets of Hunts. (They're all aluminium rimmed). Mind, I do maintain them, with bearing regreasing and the like.  Perhaps some new seals will also be a wise thing to put in, if they can be got?

Do you maintain your wheels? How did you take out the noisy bearings and put the new ones in? What was making the noise - dry bearing (no grease) or dirt in there or just poor balls and race?

How does a rim fall to pieces?  This Mavic had only had dry summer miles in my old best bike. No jumping off kerbs, no potholes. Just steady dry careful sunny miles. Can you supply any meaningful data as to why this failed other than the obvious? I also had some custom built wheels before I discovered Paul Hewitt. Riding along a straight road with a smooth surface, with 200 dry miles in the wheels, two spokes broke in the front wheel.

Biker Phil wrote:

How does a rim fall to pieces?  This Mavic had only had dry summer miles in my old best bike. No jumping off kerbs, no potholes. Just steady dry careful sunny miles. Can you supply any meaningful data as to why this failed other than the obvious? I also had some custom built wheels before I discovered Paul Hewitt. Riding along a straight road with a smooth surface, with 200 dry miles in the wheels, two spokes broke in the front wheel.

Ah, "falling to pieces" is a euphemism of the hyperbolic ilk for "cracked".

Such cracking is generally due to overtightened spokes - or so I read.  I've never had one. No doubt there are several other reasons, including "badly made rims". Does Mr Hewitt make his own rims or somehow test all those he buys in for any and every fault?

What does asking how the noisy bearings were taken out and how the new ones were put in bring to the conversation other than to deflect from your ignorance? And you claim to own two sets of Hunt wheels but seem to think that they use balls in a race? I think you will find that Hunt wheels use sealed bearings. From an engineering perspective, which I did for many years, once a sealed bearing gets noisy, regreasing  never solves the issue, it merely covers up the problem temporarily. The people who do this are usually people who think they know more than they actually do. Or are as tight as cramp. As for  'putting new seals in', I very much doubt you will find any bearing manufacturer who sells replacement seals for tiny bike bearings! 

Biker Phil wrote:

What does asking how the noisy bearings were taken out and how the new ones were put in bring to the conversation other than to deflect from your ignorance?

Putting in sealed bearings can, if the proper methods aren't used, damage the bearings, meaning the bloke in question may have started with one damaged bearing but given himself more if he put new bearings in with a method involving hammering, skewed insertion etc.. Not to say that he did that but it would be interesting to know the full history of his bearing issue.

Biker Phil wrote:

And you claim to own two sets of Hunt wheels but seem to think that they use balls in a race? I think you will find that Hunt wheels use sealed bearings.

You seem to be unaware of what a sealed bearing is. Balls in a cage in two co-planar races, with seals, all forming a cartridge.

Biker Phil wrote:

From an engineering perspective, which I did for many years, once a sealed bearing gets noisy, regreasing  never solves the issue, it merely covers up the problem temporarily. The people who do this are usually people who think they know more than they actually do. Or are as tight as cramp.

You were an engineer?  Are you sure? You seem to be unaware of what a sealed bearing catridge is and how they're maintained. All manufacturers and purveyors of such bearings recommend a maintenance regime.  Here's Hunt's, although you'll probably use your "engineering experience" to deem it "crap". 

https://help.huntbikewheels.com/support/solutions/articles/43000558015-b...

Here's Ceramic Speed's bearing maintenance advice:

https://ceramicspeed.com/en-eu/pages/bearing-cleaning-maintenance?

Are they just kidding, do you think? Perhaps they've not asked an "engineer".

Biker Phil wrote:

As for  'putting new seals in', I very much doubt you will find any bearing manufacturer who sells replacement seals for tiny bike bearings! 

Well - there are websites recommending seal replacement in bicycle sealed bearings if the original seal gets punctured when hooking it off and on during cleaning and regreasing the bearings in their races. So, we could look for them with that Google thing, eh? All bearing specialists sell a vast variety of bearing seals as well as the bearings. Here's an example:

https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/All-Oil-Seals/c4747_5571/index.html

Some obsessive marginal gains lads & lasses replace the standard bearing seals, often of the contact kind, with non-contact seals, to gain a half watt or three less friction!  How do they do it? Perhaps they make their own seals? Seems unlikely, though.

Cugel wrote:

So, we could look for them with that Google thing, eh? All bearing specialists sell a vast variety of bearing seals as well as the bearings. Here's an example:

https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/All-Oil-Seals/c4747_5571/index.html

I can't find any cartridge bearing seals on that website, just complete bearing assemblies, can you link to a specific replacement seal?

mark1a wrote:

Cugel wrote:

So, we could look for them with that Google thing, eh? All bearing specialists sell a vast variety of bearing seals as well as the bearings. Here's an example:

https://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/All-Oil-Seals/c4747_5571/index.html

I can't find any cartridge bearing seals on that website, just complete bearing assemblies, can you link to a specific replacement seal?

That website page is one offering ..... seals (as its url indicates). But not bicycle wheel hub specific seals for this or that wheelset. I'll let you Google for the seals needed for the bearing type and brand you want.

As the wheels at issue in this thread seem to be Hunt you'll be happy to know that, in reply to the question, "Do you sell seals-only to replace any damaged during hub maintenence?" Hunt say:

" ....this is not something we sell on the website but if you do damage [a wheel bearing seal] then please let us know and we can set the order up for you."

Perhaps other wheel purveyors would do the same, although not many seem to have the high service levels of Hunt.

I got their Adventure Dynamo wheelset a few years ago. A little over 18,000 miles later in all weather and including a lot of chunky gravel, I really haven't had to do a thing to them. At one point I tightened a few rear spokes trying to solve a ticking/creaking noise under high power, but it turned out to be the chainring bolts.

95kg including bike & gear. 

Keith57 wrote:

Glueing tubulars with Tufo tape is super quick and simple. Don't bother with traditional glue 😎

 I bought a second hand tubular wheelset for time trialling and the tyres were mounted with tape, they were worryingly easy to remove. I would not trust tape after that.

I have been using this tape for the last 6 years and found it very good on both alloy and carbon rims with Veloflex tubs.:https://www.wiggle.com/p/effetto-mariposa-carogna-tubular-tape

Have you compared it with traditionally glued tyres? The wheels I have are carbon and I wonder if this is more difficult to adhere to than aluminium due to the smooth surface.

Hi there. No I have not tried traditional glue so can't offer a comparison. I do use this tape on carbon rims (Campag Bora 35s) and had no issue. The tape is very strong and goes off reasonably qucikly. The only thing to be aware is making sure that you have the right width for the rim as it comes in different sizes.

Tufo tape is well know to increase rolling resistance and be slower than gluing tubulars (check out Slowtwitch for thread after thread on this). Sure 5 watts doesn't really matter for recreational riding - but if you're spending big money on special parts to compete hill climbing then you're probably taking this stuff seriously. Friends don't let friends use Tufo tape.