VIDEO: Cyclists hurt on 'lethal' Edinburgh tram tracks

Only way to practise is to use your MTB and go through the wood and over slippery tree routes running in all directions or commute on a FAT BIKE ..... or one of these ...
http://kitesurfbikerambling.wordpress.com/2013/10/17/surly-quad-bike-don...

If there were such a hazard scaled-up so that car wheels could get stuck in it, does anyone think it would be considered acceptable or that macho motorists would all rush to condemn the incompetence of any driver who fell foul of it?

Bad road design that will stop people from cycling. The net result will be that those who don't have the skills to hop the tracks or otherwise navigate than safely will simply give up on the idea of cycling. Also, try hopping your bike with panniers on or whist towing a trailer. Hopping the tracks is a solution but not for the average Joe.

FWIW I come from a BMX background and negotiating this sort of thing doesn't phase me at all (my tyres are unlikely to ever contact a wet tram line at any angle) but we need to consider this more wholistically and not just from our own viewpoints/skill levels. Cycling on city streets should be easy and safe for everybody.

For Pete's sake, did I say I like the road design there? I don't think so. But still, there will never be such thing as perfect infrastructure. That said, learning basic maneuvers like hopping the front wheel over obstacles (or at least learning to cross tram lines at a less acute angle like the other cyclist in the film did) is simply necessary if we want to ride safely. Good road design should naturally help us (and like I said, we should do our best and demand building proper infrastructure from the authorities), but will never be a substitute for proper riding skills.
@DrJDog - did I say "bunny hopping"? No, I said "hopping at least with the front wheel", which is not difficult even with a heavy bike (not to mention a light bike like the one we see here).

fukawitribe wrote:

BBB wrote:

Another reason not to use stupidly narrow tyres for commuting.

Another reason not to use stupidly narrow mind for commenting.

No, it takes a narrow mind to use a completely inappropriate bike for commuting in a city and then complaining that the quality of roads and infrastructure doesn't cater for bikes designed for a completely different purpose.

Skinny tyres are for racing/training/touring on known, open, relatively smooth roads, NOT for tackling urban "jungle" with potholes, cracks, manholes, tracks, slotted drain covers with gaps large enough to trap the wheel...

It's about picking the right tool for the job.

I'm just wondering how cyclists with cargo bikes or recumbents are coping with these tramlines.

People claiming it was the cyclist's fault, well maybe he wasn't as skilled as one might hope, but what on earth is a tram line doing running along the middle of a road where cyclists are going to have to cross it? It's rubbish design. I bet nobody from the engineering firm or local authority gave any thought to people on bikes. As usual.

If he likes playing trams so much why doesn't he just ride along with his wheels in the track the whole way!?

Yet another example of the muddled thinking and poor planning for this hopelessly bungled project to reintroduce trams to Edinburgh. This project has cost an absolute fortune due to the utter incompetence of those who brought it to fruition within the council offices in the city. It has been a shameful waste of money that could have been delivered for a good deal less, much more quickly and providing a far larger network had the council officers been rather more intelligent.

Bear in mind too that the city used to have arguably the best bus system in the UK.

The problems with Edinburgh Trams is that no thought has gone into how the trams are going to integrate with other forms of transport in Edinburgh. This while issue of cyclists and trams has been known about for four years. Yet no serious planning on how to deal with it has been done.

Sadly it is only a matter of time before someone is killed. Whether that will focus minds it is hard to tell, the powers that be might just try to shrug their collective shoulders and say that there is nothing they could do.

I lived in Melbourne for years, lots of tram tracks. When I first moved there someone told me it was a matter of when not if, that you will come a cropper at some level. I did twice, once resulted in a number of stitches on the chin and the second two months on crutches as the bike went round, but my cleat didnt release.
You have to cross them at steep enough of an angle, especially with a road bike, as 23mm tyres fit the tracks very well, but even then you will get it wrong sometimes, and the wet is worse, I dont miss them at all.

OK so while that guy clearly isn't the most experienced cyclist in the world the lack of helmet or lycra doesn't make him deserving of abuse - find me a commuter cyclist in Holland who's wearing lycra and a helmet...

The bottom line is that the junction or route or whatever it is at that point has been put in without any thought as to cyclists who need to cross it. In that one video clip there are quite a few cyclists so it's clearly a popular commuting route. I don't think his wheel actually gets caught in the rail, I think it just skids along on top of it. Either way it's a crap bit of design but then you can say that about most of Edinburgh's tram network*

* for "network" read "one 8 mile line"

In my experience it is not so much the tyres getting stuck in the grooves, but the the tyres "railing" along the top of a wet track. The happened to me in Princess St when the my back wheel slid along the top of the track as I attempted to cross them. I managed to stay upright although bizarely got a blow out and buckled wheel as a consequence.

Got a question for the locals if there's a cycle path down the middle of the tram lines who has the right of way? if a tram comes up behind you does it have to stay behind you until you follow the cycle path/route off the lines.

As is almost always the case, it would just be much better to have a road design that didn't rely on people getting it right every time.

exactly - this seems to the principle applied to designing junctions for vehicles but cyclists and pedestrians need investigational skills to work out safe routes and sometimes just to work out what is going on - I've lived in Sheffield and the main problem (other than the rain) with the tram tracks is that everything is Ok until the unexpected happens - then it can be potentially lethal to deal with. Currently live in Melbourne and Trams are usually routed down the middle of road and junctions are right angle (does rain though) so easier to negotiate

Came down on tram lines myself a couple of years back when they were laying the Metrolink extension out to Droylsden. Due to the road works I had to cross the lines on numerous occasions, often at acute angles and eventually my concentration wavered.

Needless to say I avoided that road from then on. Luckily I was wearing Lycra and a helmet otherwise my basic riding skills would've been questioned...

Also, I would be interested to know how 25mm or even 28mm tyres would negate the problem, given that the grooves are apparently 36mm wide.

Navigating tramlines is basic riding skills?

I've just been in Zurich this week which has a lot of bikers and a lot of trams, they can coexist in peace, although cycles are allowed on some pavements to help prevent them crossing busy roads. It definitely can work, with a big of caution. I remember going over a manhole cover that was hidden by leaves and somehow not falling despite the surprise 2 wheel speedway drift.... just basic riding sense, we all have to learn this stuff, hopefully the lesson isn't too painful.

I am all for protecting cyclists in municipal environment. But what is lethal here is not tram tracks. It's the lack of basic riding skills.

I think all manholes and white lines need to be removed from our roads, but only when it rains.