dhb Aeron Full Protection Softshell

I did, see post 1

This just in from dhb:

"The Aeron Full Protection Softshell is built from a Windtex fabric with a waterproof and windproof membrane, which has also been treated with a DWR coating on the outside. In heavy rain the DWR can be overwhelmed, but whilst water will soak into the softshell fabric it won’t get through the membrane (which has a waterproof rating of over 10,000mm hydrostatic head). The DWR can wash out after several washes but can be renewed with a technical wash.

We don’t however advertise this garment as ‘waterproof’ because without taped seams this can’t be completely true as in sustained rain some water will get in via the seams. 

Key distinction: built from a waterproof fabric, but the garment is not fully waterproof. We never overstate what our garments can do, and as some commenters have suggested perhaps  we have played it a bit too safe on this one"

So now you know

The review is spot on. It is my go to commute wear from Autumn to early spring but not in heavy rain. The fact its breathability is limited is notable too as on my commute, my base layer accumulates sweat. Both can be dealt with by hanging up during the day but let's say you are out for a long day with a stop start type of ride, it probably won't be the right solution as you will have a soggy base layer which will feel cold if you stop for lunch/cake for too long. If these limitations won't impact your usage, I would highly recommend it.

I have had Windtex tights for years, it's good stuff, warm, quite breathable and water resistant but heavy rain definitely gets through.

Thanks Mike. I think the problem is probably endemic in the industry in what we call things. So we work with what we have. And your clarification is appreciated. FWIW, I agree with that. Some work better than others. The Mossa takes a lot longer to wet out for example, the Gabba wets out very easily. I'd rate the Aeron somewhere between those two. I've just received a Lusso Extreme Repel which is windtex storm shield. Guaranteed water proof withg DWR but, of course, no taped seams. So it will get in, in the end.

I actually commend dhb for not giving it the description and not building up false hope. Ironically Castelli never ever talked about the Gabba being water proof but the cult of the internet seems to have built it into something that it isn't. Though, again, being a membrane, it's essentially a fairly good barrier let down by the limitations of sewing stuff together.

Ok, let me clarify:

"The fabric is 'water resistant', and shrugs off light showers with ease, but a heavy downpour will see it wet out and ultimately you'll feel the water"

The key here is *feel*. The fabric absorbs water on the top layer. This is fact. You can see it, droplets sit on the surface for a while then soak in as you move and stretch. I accept that OK, water might not get *through* the fabric, but in heavy rain this is irrelevant as it will have soaked through the seams and spread around the inside of the jacket. I agree with Bendertherobot, that Wiggle/dhb are playing it safe as any mention of 'waterproof' fabric will see people buying it on the assumption the whole thing as a system is waterproof, then returning it when they end up wet. 

And as Arfa describes, prolonged wear in heavy rain will leave you with a soaked jacket. Something worn so close to the skin, even if there's no water on the inside, will feel yucky to pull on. Critically, you will loose precious muscle warmth heating up the water inside the outer layer.

This is as opposed to a normal, breathable jersey underneath a proper waterproof hardshell, that does not absorb anything. That is the only way to remain dry and not loose energy heating up a layer unneccessarily. If you're going flat-out and then jumping into a shower or team bus then a wet Gabba or Aeron softshell is OK - you're probably going to get wetter from sweating than from ingress, and if you are going flat out then it probably helps with temperature control.

But for all-day comfort, riding below the red line, in and out of heavy rain, this probably isn't the jersey you need - it'd be way too warm under a hardshell for more than the briefest of times, and would leave you feeling damp for the rest of the day if you did get plastered in a downpour.

Ah the wonderul Mandelbrot-set-nuanced sands of cycle clothing discourse

p.s. I've asked dhb for comment

I have commuted in mine over the last year and would describe it as water resistant. It will keep a light shower out for half an hour but a heavy down pour will leave the material sodden and in need of drying. Commute in the morning in heavy rain and you will be pulling on a cold wet jacket in the evening in the absence of drying facilities. My conclusion is that is good for all conditions other than heavy rain.

Seems like big value compared to some other Windtex jackets.  Although the warmth available here suggests that it's a heavier weight fabric than that used in the Le Col one, maybe something more like the this one, which only comes out when it's below about 4 degrees.  I'd say both of these are waterproof bar the seams, which sounds like what's on offer here.

Just to echo a couple of points above. I've worn this since ~ last Feb, many, many times in torrential rain for extended periods and its never soaked through. Its more waterproof than my Sportful Fiandre NoRain tights  for example.

Indeed. I questioned the description a year ago when I first bought it. I think it's a case of Wiggle playing it safe where others play a little loose with what we term waterproof. It comes with a windtex tag but Wiggle don't up play that connection. I've worn it in torrential rain, ditto the Mossa, Mossa.2 and I've just received the Lusso Max Repel Extreme. All windtex (variants) and all waterproof. But, on all of them, it will get through the seams eventually and there will be some damp.

I've just spent a couple of minutes holding the sleeve under a running tap.  It's waterproof.  Apart from the cuff anyway. Oops.

Fantastic jacket in my experience.

I bought one of these last winter, and rode it all the way until spring, it's a fantastic, well fitted, jersey/jacket. It keeps me warm below 10 degrees with a variety of base layers depending on the actual temperature. Below 3 or 4 degrees I'll probably put a gilet on top. It was great this morning on a breezy day at 6 degrees with a long sleeve base on a vigorous hour long commute with no sweat build up. It keeps light rain off with me still snug inside. Cuffs are very well sealed, gloves go over them nicely. Easily unzipped with thicker gloves on the move for ventilation. I reckon it's a real bargain, even if you have to pay full wiggle price!

When you say wet, wet from where? dhb describe this as water resistant but the fabric is to all extents and purposes water proof. The seams aren't taped so those will always be the ingress points. The fabric will wet out but it should not penetrate the fabric itself save for the ingress points.