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TECH NEWS
shimano-9170-3.jpgDisc brakes in the pro peloton: Riders demand better safety for disc brake rollout
Today the CPA (Cyclistes Professionels Associés), a union for professional cyclists, says that the current move to introduce disc brakes doesn’t adequately guarantee the safety conditions of the riders.
The CPA says in a press release issued today that it submitted three safety requests to the UCI Equipment Commission, but it’s not happy with the outcome. The three safety requests are rounded disc rotors, safety guards and that all riders should use disc brakes to allow the same braking performance.
"At this point, there is a reason to believe that it is not yet time to start these tests," says Gianni Bugno. "As we have said several times, we are not against the technological innovation, but we are worried above all by the safety of the riders on the road.”
- 2017's hottest disc-equipped road bikes
Of those three safety requests, rounded rotors are already being introduced, but so far we’ve not seen any viable safety guards been put forward by Shimano or SRAM, the two component manufacturers that currently offer disc brakes.
And it’s clear the UCI isn’t forcing the entire peloton to switch wholesale to disc brakes, as we’ve seen individual riders Tom Boonen and Marcel Kittel using discs last month. Today Cannondale-Drapac confirmed the whole team will use discs.
Most other teams have been very quiet on the subject of introducing disc brakes. We’re a long way from the entire peloton using discs, not to mention the fact that Campagnolo hasn’t even released its disc brakes yet.
- Have disc brakes really led to injuries in peloton?
In a letter sent to the UCI Equipment Commission, CPA President Gianni Bugno also “expresses his concern about the fact that some riders are already using disc brakes in racing while the Equipment Commission is still working to improve the safety and performance of this equipment.”
“He called for a better clearness in the regulations concerning the use of the disc brakes, with the aim of reassuring the riders on the proper management of this project,” added the CPA. "We believe that the riders will finally agree and that at the end they will be happy to use these new technologies in the race, but only once the preventive safety measures that have been requested will be carried out," added Gianni Bugno.
"We also asked that all the riders will be able to use a bicycle with disc brakes as soon as possible for the training. It would be ridiculous to test such equipment for the first time in the race. This first step seems to me logical and indisputable in the process if we want to put this new system in place in our sport.”
The UCI restarted its disc brake trial this season but it has not provided any ruling on what disc brake standards should be adopted and whether an entire team or individual rider can use discs. Clearly, the UCI has left the decision up to the team, it’s not exactly forcing discs through on the teams, but does the organisation need to show better leadership in this tricky and controversial debate.
David worked on the road.cc tech team from 2012-2020. Previously he was editor of Bikemagic.com and before that staff writer at RCUK. He's a seasoned cyclist of all disciplines, from road to mountain biking, touring to cyclo-cross, he only wishes he had time to ride them all. He's mildly competitive, though he'll never admit it, and is a frequent road racer but is too lazy to do really well. He currently resides in the Cotswolds, and you can now find him over on his own YouTube channel David Arthur - Just Ride Bikes.
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41 comments
Funny, usually pro riders have nothing but good to say publicly about equipment, since they're paid to do so. But for some reason, they seem to think the industry is shoving this crap down their throats. Could it be that they are? That UCI doesn't listen? Perhaps it's that when you're an inch from the wheel in front of you, you don't want the guy in front to jam the brakes because the reaction time required is too fast? Or that he'll lose traction jamming them on and fall in front of you? Or that in addition to all the cutting surfaces already on a normal bike, you now have two more that are totally unnecessary? Perhaps that pro bikes have brakes that already work just fine and don't take away from the meager money already available? Maybe they think that CX and MTB racers have different requirements and don't ride as close? Or that the industry just wants profits and hasn't been listening to their concerns and put a guard or wider edge on the disc? Or that it's already complicated enough to get a wheel working on a broken bike and they don't want the hassle of fitting something within a millimeter after its been bent? Maybe after a career of optimizing your thinking of how brakes work in split-second situations you don't want to take the few potentially career ending spills while you adapt? That discs might overheat on a tough descent? Or maybe it's just the fear of watching that thing approach your face? Perhaps as they said, they're not opposed to discs but want better designs from the manufacturers before they get them shoved where they don't belong. Sure, discs have advantages and disadvantages, they're particularly good when wet, but I'm seeing several on both sides. These guys do this for a living, why do people just dismiss them as if they're trying to impede progress? They almost never do that without a reason.
Not much really. I used to think I was guilty of dragging too much on the MTB, although I wouldn't say I was slow on the descents, more sort of comfort dragging.
Recently I've only been commuting, so no hard stops from speed, although I had been dragging a bit more than usual recently just to keep the bloody things warm when it was raining, in an effort to prevent the aforementioned squeel.
It's not a big buckle, just a wee wobble that creates an audible skiff when I'm riding, would be fine on the MTB but on the road it's frustrating.
This is sort of why I sympathise with the mechanics, I still think that discs are more maintenance intensive than callipers, not less, for a given level of smooth silent operation at least. If outright power is important though then sure, discs all the way.
There are loads of reasons why the pro's won't want to run discs, I think safety is probably the one we hear about as its the one most people can relate to.
However, there is also....
- Slowing of wheel changes
- The need for uniformity of standards to enable neutral service
- Disc pad contamination - this one gets no air time, but it really should, have you seen the way pro mechanics clean and service bikes?
- Expense - for every super team, there will be a team making do on older equipment. all teams stock pile of wheels etc go out the window if discs are standardised
- Uniformity... all racers need to be on the same standard of braking... either rim or disc. This isn't MTB, this isn't cross... this is 100-200 riders nost to tail at all times... two braking speeds will cause problems.
I don't remember ever hearing this argument in the context of single-vs.-dual pivot calipers, or carbon vs. aluminum braking surfaces, or anything else that makes a difference in braking time.
I've buckled precisely one disc entirely because I ran it way too thin (it said 1.5mm minimum thickness, it was my first disc bike... I didn't know... I allowed it to wear down to 0.7mm) - after some emergency braking, it concertinaed enough to foul the calipers to a standstill.
I trust that in the pro peloton that the mechanics are considerably more on the ball than I was.
If you're braking hard from a high-ish speed to a standstill and then don't let off the brakes, that's how you're ending up with buckled discs. Same happens in cars - the heat in that area of the disc is trapped by the pads so has nowhere to go, baking the disc.
0.7mm thick disc attempting to slow 100kg of rolling load down a 20% gradient isn't a good mix. It was like 3 layers of baking foil. Oops. Lesson learned, I keep a monthly eye (calliper micrometer) on the disc thicknesses now.
Shimano rotors are 1.8mm thick when new and should be replaced when worn down to 1.5mm. It explicitly says so on the rotors. I've used mine to 1.4mm with no issues.
Hmmmm...that should be okay then, the bike industry is a triumph at agreeing standards, just look how many we have!
Ug, I'm more worried about the noise of 200 riders slowing from speed on a wet day, think of the squeeling! I'll be watching TdF on mute on those days, maybe the riders will need ear plugs...
Pity the poor mechanics who need to keep all those discs and callipers perfectly aligned as well, people used to say discs were advantageous over rims because they didn't buckle, but I've had more warped discs than I've had buckled rims, and a buckled rim is a damn sight easier to straighten.
Really? what you doing to your discs? I can't remember ever having a buckled disc (20 years mountain biking with discs and now 3 years with discs on my road bikes). Sure I've seen them when I worked as a mechanic, but this was generally on cheapper bikes where the discs seemed to be made of some form of polished cheese, and so warped when you not so much as breathed on them (made them easy to straighten though too).
If your calipers are cable actuated single sided types, then I feel sorry for you as you will indeed have been having to constantly adjust the brakes.
Rim brakes on carbon rims???? Noisy as all get out - in the dry.
Probably the bigger issue for the "Pro's" is the compatibility of disc wheels.
I've two road bikes with discs, same calipers and same discs on each bike, different wheels, but its not an easy swop over. The tollerances are so slight, they rub badly when exchanged and need some tweaking. Imagine this in a race situation? Most likely neutral service won't be able to help unless there's conformity on frames/wheels/discs/calipers, and even then its no exact science.
So, if they get a flat, they could have quite a wait for a wheel which fits to come...
Not true, they've already agreed to a standard.
A standard what? I've tried swapping identical wheels over from different frames with the same brake calipers and they don't fit.
I have two bikes, both disc brakes, I have 3 sets of disc wheels. Many times I've swapped wheels between the two bikes. I'm not sure if I have landed upon some magic process, but this is what I do;
My brakes didn't rub. I didn't slice off any of my limbs. The world didn't end (though I admit, this is largely attributable to step 4).
if the caliper body isn't positioned at the same relative point to the disc then swopping disc wheels between bikes may cause discs to rub on pads.
My solution was to loosen the two allen key bolts holding caliper body to frame mount, then installing wheel, squeeze brake on and then tighten up the body to mount bolts.
The disc shouldn't then rub when swapped from bike to bike.
This method also cures other disc to caliper alignment issues.
in a race?
You were one of the lucky ones
Why can't people park their personal views/ experiences on disc brakes when discussing safety concerns of the pro Peleton?
Nobody's forcing amateurs to ride discs or rim brakes so chill!
Ride what you want and get on with it.
Steady on, this kind of sane argument will get you thrown out!
Long and short : the chaps in the peloton are supposed to be professionals, right? They should be able to perform with any tool without killing or injuring each other.
"At this point, there is a reason to believe that it is not yet time to start these tests," says Gianni Bugno, ex Italian national champion "The reason is the fact that Campagnolo hasn’t even released its disc brakes yet"
Is riding down a mountain at over 100 kph safe, often with no safety between the road and a big drop....
Pros don't complain about that though.
There is something inherently dangerous about bicycle racing. Surely beeing able to stop quicker in marginal conditions and having superior brake control al round is good?
A few references to MTB above. From memory, there were issues with safety when disc brakes were first introduced to MTBs but mostly relating to the effects of braking forces on the forks and wheel retention systems. This led to the introduction of 'lawyer tabs' on forks following several serious injuries caused when wheels dropped out of the forks under braking and susequently to through-axle retention systems being introduced rather than QR spindles. Something to do with increased torque and rotational forces under braking?
The pro-peleton will seek to retain as quick a method as possible to replace wheels so this would appear to be an area that requires investigation, research or whatever.
Disc brakes weigh considerably more than calipers, and on a light weight, skinny tyred road bike the best performance gain you're going to get is bit more modulation on a wet descent. Provided you've got enough braking force the lock the wheel at will, it is tyre grip that determines your maximum deceleration.
They make sense on an MTB (both of mine have hydraulic discs) because you've got much more issues with mud on the rims, bigger tyres, heavier bike etc. and total weight isn't so critical to bike performance. But I stuck with calipers on my latest road bike build because discs just do not make any sense 99% of the time.
I don't profess to be better at this than a pro mechanic, but one of the fucntions of pro teams is to sell their sponsor's kit, regarless of how good it is. This is probably a better argument for making the whole peloton to adopt discs - nobody gets an advantage on the climbs because they aren't being made to haul heavy disc brakes their sponsor wants to flog to fans.
From what I understand the 6.8kg bike weight limit has been out of date for years and pro level bikes could be made much lighter than this if they wanted to...with some teams even adding lead weights to make the bike meet the limit.
If this is true it shouldn't be too hard to make a 6.8kg disc bike should it?
Agree about the sponsors. Unless teams want to buy their bikes they should be made to ride discs...will make it more exciting when people get decapitated etc
(actually, riders protested about mandatory helmet use didn't they? How can they be trusted on safety concerns after that?)
Yes they protested about mandatory helmet use and since there has been no reducion in deaths or serious head injuries in professional racing after use became mandatory it seems they were right to do so. The industry needed to be able to sell helmets and if racers in the big tours etc. didn't need them then it would be hard sell to the public wouldn't it? So they became mandatory despite there being no evidence as to their actual effectiveness.
Now the riders are uncertain about possible benefits or disadvantages of disc brakes in very tight bunched racing and have some concerns about increased risks. In the absence of any actual evidence it seems sensible to stick to the current brakes until/unless the concerns about risks can be alleviated.
Out of interest, have you tried riding a bike with hydraulic discs?
Disc brakes are better not because of extra stopping power, although they require less hand force, but because they are far more controllable. This enables you to get closer to locking the wheel without risking actually locking it. This is how they let you stop quicker.
Rain has infinitely more to do with braking issues on rims than mud.
As others have pointed out, UCI weight limit makes weight of brakes irrelevant.
I strongly suspect this reaction from this pro riders' group is just traditionalism masquerading as safety concerns.
But seeing as the manufacturers add weight to all the bikes in order to meet the UCI minimum weight regulations thats really a non argument.
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