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Exactly, there has been some  real heavy handedness here. Best use of resources to 'enforce' the lockdown? Probably not.

ktache wrote:

Ta for the Midsummer reminder, if there really is nothing else on.

There is a headline for 11.10

Bike shop booked up by "stir crazy" cyclists,

now I can figure out a story, but are there any specifics?

A friend of mine (he moved away from Reading this weekend), was actually one of the cyclists in that episode and he said they were there all day getting cold and barely did any cycling. Midsommer is also sometimes filmed around another friend's farm and once inside his actual house.

Who would book with that miserable lot again anyway?

Smashed it there ktache!

You deserve a 'chapeau'

Hardly a disgrace when Derbyshire police have had to deal with clowns travelling to the force area to have bbq's, smoke shisha pipes in groups and go walking in remote locations ignoring the 'unnecessary travel' instructions. Guess the force just had enough of dealing with idiots and anyway a drone is a better resource to patrol a remote location.

As for the 'police state's comment, what a dramatic tosser. Guess I've missed the roving state death squads! Having spent time in a real 'police state' this man clearly has never known real violent oppression. Guess he doesn't like being told 'no' by plebs

A friend of Mrs Badger lives on the Peak District, just near one of the areas that has been roped off.

She doesn't really fancy running on open roads, so there's her exercise curtailed.

I suggested that she should cut the ropes and continue, but she is not as obstreperous as me, and so is now in effect confined indoors, unlawfully.

So this particular force has cynically used outlier examples of idiotic behaviour (eg BBQs etc, idiotic at any time) to justify the prevention of the cooperative majority going about their lawful business. Granted the outcomes are less deadly, but yes the principle does seem a little police-statey to me, apropos overreach and misuse of power.

Those walking in the Peaks are as capable of maintaining social distance as those in towns and cities - this was an absolute waste of Police resources, and certainly overstepped the line by enforcing "regulations" that never existed in the first place.

"Common sense" would have dictated that a few dog walkers in family groups maintaining distance from others was as close to zero risk as my morning local runs with my daughters, and therefore should be left alone.

And as for dying lakes - did the Derby and Joan Boys in Blue conduct an environmental risk assessment before this ridiculous zero value action? I should coco....

I would have thought the dye in the lakes was more likely to attract visitors, looking for their novelty Instagram snap, than to deter them.

Captain Badger wrote:

 

And as for dying lakes - did the Derby and Joan Boys in Blue conduct an environmental risk assessment before this ridiculous zero value action? I should coco....

Given how toxic that lake is anyway, I think that anything short of tipping nuclear waste into it probably doesn't add anything that it doesn't already have!

It's been dyed before a few times over the year to try to dissuade swimmers. Apparently the idea of building a fence around it is too much to consider...

That said, IMHO it was a waste of scare police resources, and that, combined with their wildly overzealous interpretation of the "laws", guidance, regulations and advice has opened them up for some thoroughly justified scrutiny and they deserve all the flak they get.

Current guidance says nothing about "time spent" exercising and nothing about what you can and can't wear when exercising (referring back to their ridiculous passive-aggressive "lycra-clad" tweet).

Unfortunately the likes of Michael Gove then go and offer an opinion on tv & pieces like this in The Times are the result which ive already seen cited on social media as people claiming these are now the governments rules and muddies the whole thing further for the average Joe&Jane public https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/an-hours-walk-should-do-says-michael-...

Don't forget Grant Shapps with his "only go food shopping once a week" statement, which was then contradicted by No 10.

It rather seems that the Govt didn't think through what they actually wanted to put in the legislation before they made it law.  As if all the ministers and the Govt are making comments based on Draft A when they actually made Draft B law.

And the police are working from Draft C...

Is it toxic as part of Derbs police's deterrence programme?

I don't see a problem with it.  The point about the lockdown is not to get the lawyers involved, arguing the toss over exactly what constitutes what.  We all know what the common sense meaning is (the leglislation may not specifically say that riding on a 150 mile technically challenging loop is prohibited, but we know we shouldn't do it.  Same goes for a 50 mile drive for a walk in the woods).

Just think of the bigger picture, there are thousands dying and some self righteous twonks are moaning about the technicalities of a law that was only brought in because many people kept acting selfishly and ignoring the risks they are placing on themselves and an over-stretched NHS (where people are risking their lives on a daily basis).

they arent arguing the bleep about this, its an important distinction that even in a crisis like this we shouldnt lose sight of, the police should police primarily through consent, and police only within the legal position of the laws that are there, they dont enforce their interpretations of it, their opinions,their preferences or their or anyone elses desires or wishes, or even attempt to assume the intent of a law.

So the stories that have come out over the weekend of the police fining people for buying non essential goods, telling shops they cant stock easter eggs,fining people for driving a car, putting black dye in a lake, warning people for sitting on benches, warning people for merely visiting elderly parents even though they stayed 2m away at all times, telling people they can exercise only for 1hr max. all the police officers doing stuff like that, got it wrong, and need to be pushed back on to make sure they get it right.

I'm with Awavey on this, this bunch of shysters fecked up by ignoring who and the evidence that adopting their ridiculous plans was doomed. 
 

Also don't forget who has underfunded the nhs for years, not given it resources it clearly needed as evidenced by the mock exercise in 2016. And is lying through its teeth every time it's idiots are giving press briefings. 

'Just think of the bigger picture…'

whoosh…

We need to keep it all in context. The video 'per se' is not a disgrace, neither is it out of order. It points out examples of behaviour which are unhelpful in the current crisis, such as people "walking the dog in the peak district" and labels that as "non-essential", which it is! That dog could be exercised in a back yard or a by walking around the block. Yes, it's nice to take in the air and walk the dog in some remote beauty spot, but it's NOT essential. Spare a thought for inner city single mums with 2 kids stuck in a council flat with no outdoor space.

Actions of the police may appear over the top, but if you've ever tried to control a large group of people you'll know that having some set a bad example tends to encourage everyone to do so and then the situation gets out of hand. Instead of screaming outrage, perhaps "Lawyers" and "Lords" should get onside with the government and encourage people to do what they're asked to do for a change and save the arguing for when the lives have been saved.

People are being asked to stay at home, it's not difficult, but it IS essential. The sooner people get the hang of it the sooner we can all get back to normal. Failure to do so will result in even more draconian measures and no doubt more wailing and pounding of fists by the those that don't like being denied their civil liberties.  

Which part of "stay at home" are people having difficulty in understanding?

I refer you to my earlier post - the Peak District (along with countless other national, royal,local parks) is back yard for a large number of people, many of whom do not have their own gardens, or roads with pavements suitable for walking/running/your exercise of choice.

The Derbs Police managed to reduce risk by zero with this silly action, but certainly managed to put the backs up a lot of people, which will have a chilling effect on cooperation.

It is not essential to stay at home (as the Govt have made clear with guidelines on exercise), it is essential to maintain social distancing, which is perfectly possible in the Peaks, I would have thought.

The police don't get a free pass to act like eejits just because we live in interesting times - most forces are maintaining the current situation admirably without resorting to behaving like Arnold Rimmer.

I refer you to my earlier post. The message would get across far better and for everyone's benefit if people sided with the government advice and argued later.  
The police were not eejits and did not "name and shame", they even blurred faces and were only giving examples of behaviour deemed non essential. 
The latest government advice says "Stay at home. Only go outside for food, health reasons or work (but only if you cannot work from home)". If you are unfamiliar I suggest https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus

The New Forest is my back yard but I live in a flat with no balcony or garden. I am riding on my usual routes, but reducing mileage and time spent outdoors. Hopefully if we all restrict non essential journeys I may be allowed to continue exercising in my "back yard".

FWIW My sister is a frontline nurse in the Emergency department and her advice is very clear. Stay home. 

You seem to suggest that we should all stay indoors, so that you can continue to exercise outdoors in the New Forest - your back yard.

I suspect that had the Hampshire Constabulary behaved in a similar way to Derbs you might not be quite so sanguine.

I am perfectly familiar with gov advice thanks, but am grateful to you for sending me a link just in case. Luckily, your own quote says it all - "Stay at home. Only go outside for food, health reasons or work (but only if you cannot work from home)".

Last time I looked health involves exercise, which the gov has been particular in singling out as an essential. As indeed have health professionals, to better prepare folks for fighting off this virus should we be infected, and that doesn't even mention the mental health effects of being couped up for an indeterminate time (Mental health level has a significant influence on the immune system. In addition secondary effects of poor mental health in a population will cause further strain on the health/emergency services).

I said not that the police were eejits (I think we can all agree that "The police don't get a free pass to act like eejits" under any circumstance), however, Derbs handling of this situation leaves a lot to be desired, and has drawn criticism not only from plebs like me, but also policing and legal professionals. It has also indirectly prompted the gov to clarify guidelines and to reiterate the need to police by consent rather than enforcement.

Lastly, my thanks to your sister and her colleagues for their amazing work under extraordinary circumstances. I wonder whether you will follow her advice?

bikercub wrote:

The message would get across far better and for everyone's benefit if people sided with the government advice and argued later.  

Did I miss a memo?  I thought we still lived in a democracy where we follow the law, not the whims of an individual politician or policeman...

Mindlessly siding with the Gubmint and questioning later? What could possibly go wrong?