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“I wholeheartedly disagree with his approach” – YouTube driving instructor Ashley Neal on CyclingMikey

Driving school owner visits Gandalf Corner but says many road rage incidents captured by Mike van Erp are of his own making

Footballer-turned driving instructor Ashley Neal says that he “wholeheartedly” disagrees with the approach taken by fellow YouTuber CyclingMikey in trying to make roads safer, saying that by confronting law-breaking drivers he actually creates many road rage incidents.

Neal, who runs a driving school in Liverpool, visited London’s Regents Park and the junction nicknamed Gandalf Corner where, for several years now, Mike van Erp – Cycling Mikey – has regularly positioned himself, filming law-breaking drivers often on their mobile phone, or going the wrong side of a keep left sign to try and avoid queueing traffic.

In an eight-minute YouTube video, Neal explains how Gandalf Corner, which he describes as an “unremarkable” junction got its nickname, highlights some examples of law-breaking drivers there – including by using footage from CyclingMikey’s own YouTube channel.

“He’s caught many people over the years,” Neal explains. “Most are reported to the police. Some receive fines and points on the licence, others just have driver improvement courses, and there’s a few who don’t get any punishment whatsoever.”

Certainly, Neal has no truck with drivers who break the law – he points out that “impatience is normally the reason many road users take this short cut, however, this puts others at risk,” and that “pedestrians are only going to be expecting vehicles to be coming from their right as they cross this section of road, they wouldn’t expect vehicles to be coming from the opposite side of the road.”

He also highlights that van Erp “also catches a lot of people on their mobile phone, usually when they’re just queueing in traffic,” although he quickly qualifies that by adding, “that doesn’t mean that using your mobile phone while queueing in traffic is allowed,” mentioning the stricter laws that came into force earlier this year.

What Neal does appear to have an issue with, however, is van Erp – and other cyclists who use cameras – submitting that footage to the police for potential action to be taken against the motorists concerned, even though that is something that police forces across the country actively encourage.

“Mikey also takes great pride in showcasing all the fines that people have got and the points they got on the licence,” he says. “This isn't something that I would do. Most of you understand my educational stance on things. I've never reported anyone for anything.

“That doesn't mean reporting is a bad thing. It just depends on your own single circumstances. And for me, I run a driving school in Liverpool. I'm responsible for many instructors and all their students. If I was reporting every single thing that I saw, the negativity towards those instructors and students would definitely have a negative effect on road safety.

“The next thing is that if I reported every single offence that I saw I’d have no time to do anything else,” he adds.

Both have huge reach through their social media channels. Neal’s YouTube channel has 106,000 subscribers, compared to just over 80,000 on CyclingMikey’s channel – and views of individual videos posted by van Erp often run into several millions, while the driving instructor’s most popular upload is currently 3,000 short of seven figures.

Neal does use his YouTube presence to educate motorists over how to drive safely, as well as highlighting examples of poor driving (including, ironically, his own, as highlighted in the link below) – but in this case, he also points out that some cyclists break the law, too.

> Footballer-turned-driving instructor Ashley Neal divides opinion with use of horn in overtaking video

“What Mikey has done is actually rallied many cyclists to take a similar reporting approach,” he says. “This may have a positive impact nationally on stopping people using their mobile phones, but honestly, I think it's created a different problem. I've actually asked Mikey about this on his videos before but he didn't respond.

“Quite often you can see on the footage while he’s challenging the motorist for contravening the keep left bollard, cyclists doing exactly the same.

“Now, I understand that anyone driving a tonne’s worth of metal is going to do a hell of a lot more damage than anyone riding a bike, but with the speeds involved at this junction and at this crossing area, honestly, it becomes a lot less relevant.

“Some motorists think because of the lack of requirement for number plates and licences to ride a bicycle, cyclists are getting away with things that motorists don't.

“I understand that this is a false equivalence and the updates to the Highway Code back this up. But this way of looking out for your own is wrong, you're either pro road safety or not, This disparity between different types of road users just causes resentment and divide.

“We've now got legions of cyclists, all around the country, trying to capture that moment and shouting ‘you're on camera, you know’.

“If you catch someone committing an offence, just report it if you wish to. Plainly and simply we need to be building bridges, not creating divide. All roads need to be shared safely and sensibly.”

“If you haven’t seen Mikey’s videos, please check them out. And also, I'd like you to tell me whether you find them entertaining, whether they help with. road safety or whether they hinder,” Neal continues.

“In my personal opinion, I wholeheartedly disagree with his approach, he effectively camps out here and creates many of these road rage incidents, all of his own accord.

“He could just record the offenders and then report them to the police anyway, without standing in and blocking the road. I've actually seen on a number of his uploads different types of road users taking to the pavement because of his actions,” he adds.

What Neal does not mention, but van Erp has in numerous media appearances, including on the road.cc Podcast, is one of the principal reasons why he is so passionate about making the roads safer and bringing law-breaking motorists to justice  – his father was killed by a drink driver while van Erp was still a teenager.

> Tired of road crime”: CyclingMikey on episode 16 of the road.cc Podcast

A number of van Erp’s followers on Twitter expressed support for him, with @velobetty for example saying that while she usually respects Neal’s opinions, “I think he's pretty wrong on this one.”

Van Erp himself – currently enjoying a cycling holiday on the Continent – is aware of the video, but says he won’t be watching it.

Simon joined road.cc as news editor in 2009 and is now the site’s community editor, acting as a link between the team producing the content and our readers. A law and languages graduate, published translator and former retail analyst, he has reported on issues as diverse as cycling-related court cases, anti-doping investigations, the latest developments in the bike industry and the sport’s biggest races. Now back in London full-time after 15 years living in Oxford and Cambridge, he loves cycling along the Thames but misses having his former riding buddy, Elodie the miniature schnauzer, in the basket in front of him.

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188 comments

Avatar
grOg | 2 years ago
1 like

Ashley is going to cop some hate from all the van Twerp supporters on here..

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horrovac | 2 years ago
9 likes

I have had an interaction with him when, in his video on braking vs. evading, he had a footage from a cyclist who gets cut off by a driver coming out of a side street. The cyclist manages to evade the car by going behind it, gets up on the sidewalk and finally hits a fence (not very hard). Ashley's comment was: "don't your brakes work?". I, along with a number of others, analysed the footage, distances and times of events and came to the conclusion that, given the speed of the cyclist, they DID brake quite forcefully and managed to evade quite competently - not overbraking while maneuvering to avoid crashing and sliding under the car, avoiding rough maneuvering over the gritty/slippery bit of the intersection, not trying to avoid hitting the sidewalk and ending with hitting it in an acute angle, but getting on it and (apparently) using the fence as the last bit of braking. He wouldn't have none of that. I attempted to explain that he misinterpreted the footage due to the wide angle lens of the action camera, but all I got was the stereotypical sarcasm about cyclists thinking they own the street and so on... Essentially, he was arguing that it was the CYCLIST's fault, because they shouldn't have been going so fast if they can't stop immediately when someone illegaly jumps out of a side street, and that they should have taken extra care because they're so vulnerable. Frankly, I did not find him fair at all, but aggressive and combattive and unwilling to listen to arguments and learn something. Can't say for sure, but he does seem to have a bee in his bonnet when it comes to cyclists.

Avatar
Hirsute replied to horrovac | 2 years ago
7 likes

He did come on here to debate overtaking cyclists and use of the horn. He did not listen to what was said.
Engage with stakeholders then ignore their input.

Avatar
Daveyraveygravey | 2 years ago
5 likes

Funny how Ashley Neal trots out the line about a car being a "tonne of metal".  The average new car in 2020 was 1.9 tonnes, nearly double his estimate.  And cars are only getting heavier as they get more electrification.

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chrisonabike | 2 years ago
5 likes

I wonder whether Ashley Neal ever lambasted a referee in a former life for creating pitch rage by referring things to the video assistant referee?

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Rendel Harris replied to chrisonabike | 2 years ago
3 likes
chrisonatrike wrote:

I wonder whether Ashley Neal ever lambasted a referee in a former life for creating pitch rage by referring things to the video assistant referee?

Even I, whose knowledge of football could be fitted into a matchbox without taking the matches out first, know that his career was over long before VAR!

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chrisonabike replied to Rendel Harris | 2 years ago
1 like

Alright!  It's hard enough trying to keep up with the cycle ball.

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anagallis_arvensis | 2 years ago
4 likes

Great, he's going to teach us how to ride bikes!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5MvDgbIEx28

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hawkinspeter replied to anagallis_arvensis | 2 years ago
2 likes
anagallis_arvensis wrote:

Great, he's going to teach us how to ride bikes! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5MvDgbIEx28

He should do one of his shows from a bike - it might give him a renewed perspective on road danger.

Edit: watched a bit of that video and that does appear to be his intention

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AlsoSomniloquism replied to hawkinspeter | 2 years ago
5 likes

One of my first introductions to his videos was when he stated about a near miss he had by bike. I believe his conclusion was it was his fault as the driver was expected to be awful so he should have anticpated that

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to AlsoSomniloquism | 2 years ago
4 likes
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:

One of my first introductions to his videos was when he stated about a near miss he had by bike. I believe his conclusion was it was his fault as the driver was expected to be awful so he should have anticpated that

This can be a problem when society continually pushes the car agenda and people are taught to think of traffic just in terms of motor vehicles. Just because someone is on a bike doesn't necessarily mean that they'll come to the correct conclusion (over time they tend to come around though).

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anagallis_arvensis replied to hawkinspeter | 2 years ago
3 likes

He will only see what he wants to see. He did a cycling video before, did it when the roads were empty due to lock down and decided the roads were fine!!

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ste.gt13 replied to hawkinspeter | 2 years ago
0 likes

He's made quite a few cycling videos. 

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hawkinspeter replied to ste.gt13 | 2 years ago
5 likes
ste.gt13 wrote:

He's made quite a few cycling videos. 

I did watch a couple of minutes of him unpacking a new bike frame from a sponsor and he said that he intends to ride it around to pick up more experience of cycling on roads since the Highway Code changes. Others on here have reported that Ashley is quite mistaken about some aspects of cycling, so it could be interesting to see if he changes his mind on anything.

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AlsoSomniloquism replied to anagallis_arvensis | 2 years ago
2 likes

Well at least he won't be talking to a camera whilst "in control" of a 1.5 ton moving vehicle. 

 

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Hirsute replied to anagallis_arvensis | 2 years ago
2 likes

Or just leave it bikability - the ones who are trained in this.

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AlsoSomniloquism replied to Hirsute | 2 years ago
2 likes

Imagine the moans from drivers when even more cyclists cycle "in the middle of the road". 

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ste.gt13 replied to anagallis_arvensis | 2 years ago
0 likes

He's probably going to do videos on road safety for cycling

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chrisonabike replied to ste.gt13 | 2 years ago
1 like
ste.gt13 wrote:

He's probably going to do videos on road safety for cycling

If you get 'em before the road.cc staff do, post them.  I've no doubt they'll attract interest.

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Richard D | 2 years ago
8 likes

I wholeheartedly disagree with the approach of some ex-footballlaying YouTuber when he says that cyclists should not protect themselves by using cameras.

Frankly it would be nice if the standards of drivers - and driving instructors - we're good enough so that we did not have to, but they're not so we do.

Dear Ashley - **** right off.

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Velophaart_95 replied to Richard D | 2 years ago
2 likes

Really?? I think he's pretty fair, and lives in the real world, and not some fantasy world that too many cyclists wish to inhabit. 

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chrisonabike replied to Velophaart_95 | 2 years ago
4 likes

La la la, can't be done here, it's just not the way it is, get with the real world, university of life - school of hard knocks ...

You're right, some of us are dreamers.   And so were some Finns, Swedes, Spaniards, Swiss, Parisians...

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to Velophaart_95 | 2 years ago
4 likes
Velophaart_95 wrote:

Really?? I think he's pretty fair, and lives in the real world, and not some fantasy world that too many cyclists wish to inhabit. 

I reckon cyclists have a better grasp of reality than drivers as we get to see it directly and not just through a window.

Also, what's with all the car adverts showing glamorously open roads?

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brooksby replied to Velophaart_95 | 2 years ago
1 like
Velophaart_95 wrote:

Really?? I think he's pretty fair, and lives in the real world, and not some fantasy world that too many cyclists wish to inhabit. 

I have no desire to live in Middle Earth or Narnia.

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chrisonabike replied to brooksby | 2 years ago
5 likes
brooksby wrote:

I have no desire to live in Middle Earth or Narnia.

Good because that would be 'elfish, ent-itled and you won't find everyone else fauning over your fantasy world.

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mdavidford replied to chrisonabike | 2 years ago
4 likes

Are you just trolling now?

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chrisonabike replied to mdavidford | 2 years ago
1 like

Orcrist, no!

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grOg replied to Richard D | 2 years ago
1 like

'he says that cyclists should not protect themselves by using cameras'.. you are wrong; Ashley stated “He could just record the offenders and then report them to the police anyway, without standing in and blocking the road."

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JLasTSR | 2 years ago
2 likes

I have always wondered why Cycling Mikey confronted those that he filmed. Telling them that has filmed them and that it will be 6 points on their licence or somesuch. I am not against filming and reporting of incidents in fact I am quite pro that. Confronting somebody and bragging to them that you have caught them seems to be a bit unnecessary. Course not so good to watch on YouTube without the slanging match!

Avatar
nosferatu1001 replied to JLasTSR | 2 years ago
6 likes

It gives them instant info and feedback on their dangerous driving.  

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