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forum
The Reform Party and the UK’s lurch towards fascism
I posted an earlier version of this a while back - inspired to do update following THAT discussion about all things ULEZ.
The “manifesto”, in terms of transport, only mentions stopping HS2, but there’s plenty on the usual right-wing obsessions: Brexit, immigration, veterans and climate change. I had another look because I worry about the ongoing decline of the two main political parties.
If the Cons stay wedded to Brexit, then we will go into the next GE with all the widespread impoverishment Brexit has ushered in - not helped by Covid, Putin, etc. People generally vote according to their pockets. I don’t get Labour’s current position on Europe either, but let’s see how that evolves, and even the Cons may also evolve, or even pivot, but time is already running out for them.
Several roads now lead to the horrors of a further lurch to the right in this country. Let’s hope Labour get the GE landslide the polls are predicting - but we’re still at least a year out from the real campaigning beginning.
A cycling angle? With the Reform Party and its ilk, Facebook Steve and Nextdoor Dave attain real political influence. It’s not spelt out in the manifesto, but you can see where this is probably heading and what it is likely to mean for cycling. You can bet that this lot are very much "on the side of hard working drivers" etc.
As you all know, Dave’s going to “sort the traffic” and no doubt show them lazy planners how it’s done: Steve thinks the Council are corrupt, the police blinkered and is, if he can fit it in to his busy schedule he’s going to “teach them Lycra’s a thing or two.” It won’t concern him that his Mondeo is 3 months out of MoT or that Mrs Steve sometimes drives the kids in it uninsured.
As vulnerable road users, vulnerable people, we rely a great deal on the rule of law for protection. The rule of law means that we understand what the laws are, they are in general fair, and how they are applied and to whom is even-handed and consistent.
The fascist position is broadly the opposite - it’s all off-the-cuff to support today’s particular agenda - that’s why the Iain Duncan-Smith “happy to see ULEZ infra vandalised” comment is, as an example, so very worrying. In the Conservatives, here is a party happy to send signals to enable the mob to attack RNLI stations, beat up immigrants, shout at teachers, doctors etc.
This right-wing stuff works by allowing/enabling significant privileged groups to to think of themselves as the downtrodden underdog and here is a way to fight back. The pro Brexit campaign played on people’s ignorance, fears and prejudices exactly as this does.
It’s all about freedom, innit, less regulation, less tax burden, and damn the climate. There’s more polar bears now, so it’s fine. Let’s have open-cast coal mining, lithium mining and fracking. The section on climate change stumbles around like a Friday night drunk, trying to explain he wasn't being racist to the barman - a denier position emerges, unsurprisingly.
In places, the mask really slips: “We must keep divisive woke ideologies such as Critical Race Theory (CRT) and gender ideology out of the classroom.” - to be honest, I don’t even know what those two are.
The standard enemies are put up - the civil service, the BBC. Amid all the thrust and parry, there’s nothing about making a better, more inclusive and cohesive world to live in; arts, sports and culture don’t feature in this barstool view of the world: a dullard’s grim vision.
Don’t be a member of the wrong sort of minority would be my advice, should any of this come to pass.
If you're new please join in and if you have questions pop them below and the forum regulars will answer as best we can.
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Latest Comments
- wtjs 16 min 27 sec ago
I'm not a Lance fan at all but the snarky tone of this is just dumb....
- HarrogateSpa 36 min 15 sec ago
Report to the police. Social media posts are easy but usually achieve little.
- Rendel Harris 1 hour 27 min ago
mdavidfrodo?
- BikingBud 2 hours 48 min ago
How can anybody reject the beauty of that? It's a wonderful mix of modern tech yet absolutely functional.
- amawby 3 hours 56 min ago
Not unless theVED is made eye wateringly expensive....
- andystow 4 hours 24 min ago
Hyponatremia is a real risk even for an amateur cyclist or runner in hot weather. I've bonked from it before, and I was drinking Gatorade the whole...
- wtjs 5 hours 6 min ago
in the UK we have policing which to a greater or lesser extent relies on assistance from members of the public......
- Cadcam 6 hours 11 min ago
Just wanted to share a quick thank you to everyone who helped out in this thread....
- SecretSam 6 hours 25 min ago
So...don't cycle on it. Lots of other routes around that area. Source: I used to work there.
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We don't elect Prime Ministers.
You're technically correct (the best kind of correct).
People do vote for Prime Ministers and/or parties though.
Firstly, kudos for the quote.
People do vote for a party based on the leader but that doesn't change the way the system actually works.
Whilst I think it is technically possible to have an unelected Prime Minister we haven't had one in a rather long time.
Arguably, we've only ever had unelected Prime Ministers though they were elected MPs.
The major issue I had with the last couple of PMs was that the general public had no say in their promotions and there was no suggestion at the previous general election that they would be handed the keys of power. Well, that and their abysmal performances and general evilness.
At least with Johnson, a lot of people voted with the belief that he would be a better choice for Prime Minister than Corbyn (not something that I agree with, but I don't often hold popular opinions).
I was referring to the possibility of having a prime minister who is not even an elected MP. We've seen it several times in recent years with other ministeries and, I believe, it is also possible with the Prime Minister.
I would also agree that government stability is a key advantage of FPTP, although not, in my opinion, enough of an advantage to outweigh its failings.
Wales uses a hybrid system of FPTP and PR which seems to work well and retains much of the advantage of each system whilst being a tad less intuitive than either.
It's possible, though unlikely. It's unlikelyness that got Churchill the role.
Didn't know that.
Every day's a school day!
Churchill was a sitting MP when he became Prime Minister. The last PM to be appointed when not an MP was Alec Douglas-Home in 1964, but that was only for two weeks while he renounced his peerage and won a hastily-arranged by-election. The last PM to serve full terms when not an MP was the Marquess of Salisbury, whose last government was 1895-1902.
But he was up against Lord Halifax, and it was him that couldn't be prime minister because Halifax was the lord.
Respectfully, that's not actually the case: Halifax had massive support with the King, the House of Lords and the Conservative party all backing him as their choice of PM to replace Chamberlain, with Labour also indicating that he was an acceptable choice to them. It was agreed that in view of the national emergency the convention that the PM should be an MP (and it was, and still is, only a convention, not a law) could safely be ignored. It was Halifax himself who turned down the invitation from Chamberlain to succeed him because he thought that Churchill could do a better job (and he thought he could have more influence as deputy PM than as PM with Churchill as his deputy, as he knew that whatever position Churchill was given he would try to run the show anyway). Also he simply couldn't face it, in fact the thought of becoming PM made him feel physically ill. It was put around by Halifax and his supporters that he had turned the job down because he thought it wasn't appropriate for him to be PM without being an MP but that was rather a face-saving measure that looked better than simply saying he didn't fancy the job.
Of course it is highly unlikely that a non-MP would be offered the job now, particularly as Labour, the Conservatives and the LDs all have it written into their constitution that only MPs can stand for the party leadership. I did read during the election campaign that the Tories had a plan in place if they had won the majority but Sunak had lost his seat for him to remain as PM and, as with Alec Douglas-Home as I previously mentioned, for a Tory MP in a safe constituency to give up their seat for a by-election to allow Sunak swiftly to return to the Commons. That was just a "reliable sources say" report though, don't know how true it was or whether they would have put it into action if they'd had the chance.
A fine response Rendal, I was being a bit too concise, unlike your full explanation.
There's a wonderful bit in The World at War on it.
ITV used to make exceptional documentaries.
That used to be shown on a continuous loop on the History Channel on Freeview, one episode each day, at a time (a while ago now I'm pleased to say) when I was quite seriously ill and confined to barracks for an extended period; I must've watched the whole thing start to finish at least four times and learned more from it than any other series I've ever seen, marvellous.
Came here for the cycling, stayed for the politics and history!
fair enough, but remember there is a cycling connection with the potential rise of right-wing/ gammon politics, which is the natural home of all things anti-cycling.
Pleased to hear today that France has not succumbed.
I though Mussolini famously made the bicycles run on time though?
You can of course do all kind of actions using a bicycle.
It's an interesting tool in that it is private transport, but with (from where the UK stands) distributed benefits. Of course I guess it's possible the likes of GM or Amazon could possibly create a (e)bicycle monopoly or effectively take over the cycle infra...
Not forgetting the Reform plan to ignore Nett Zero.
No environment, no cycle..
I understand that, but because "events" (or just the shifts of perceived public opinion) that happens all the time. "Stop the boats" would be one, from nothing to a major policy focus (and perhaps would have already been a done deal without the upper chamber saying "what you've got here is legally wild"). Wars and military operations another.
Some truth there, although one could argue that the more parties have set specific numbers for things in the past the more fudge they've have to deploy later to justify they'd somehow "succeeded" (migration numbers are a good way to do that...)
I note they didn't bring back Blair's pledge card!
There are some specific commitments; however it's far too light on the transport side for me.
At some point some government will have to deal with the NHS model hot potato but not yet! Addressing how that ties in with social care is a first step but this is like an even bigger version of the "cars" issue. It's a "problem of success" and it's very hard to see people essentially voting for less, or to pay more...
They kinda did... different pledges (they called them commitments), and there were six not five (one louder).
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/article/2024/may/16/labour-six-pled...
Nobody sent me one!
Hmm... perhaps the Evil Cycling Lobby should have issued its own:
I pledge to:
- be "all over the road" including "in the middle of the road"
- appear out of nowhere
- be garishly clad in hi-vis and lycra, while being invisible
- go far too fast
- slow everybody down
- demand "space for cycling" in an entitled manner while simultaneously using the roads - which are for motor traffic
- abolish road tax for cyclists
I think we should get all drivers to curtsey whenever a cyclist goes past them.
Also, cake should feature somewhere
Just like thatcher then.
Funny how right whingers now want electoral reform.
In his defence, he has mentioned it before
I've always wanted electoral reform.
Voted for AV in the referendum.
I'm guessing you're happy with a super majority being delivered by 1/3rd of the votes?
Keep guessing. I am happy that Cymru is a tory free zone, just need to get rid of the unionists now. Then we can act like a normal country.
Wait for the Welsh Government elections.
The same vote share there would deliver very different results.
Indeed.
No such thing as a super majority in UK parliament.
Thatcher got 144 seat majority in 83 with 42.4 % with a turn out of 72.7 %.
Once you get a certain number of seats you can pretty much push through anything.
I'm more concerned about the turnout this week - only 60%. No one can claim a mandate on that level. It would be interesting to see some demographics in the voting.
It's a turn of phrase in the UK not a technical definition as it is elsewhere.
Thatcher's majority, whilst still unrepresentative compared to PR, was a lot closer to being representative than the recent result. BBC have said it's the widest margin in seats-votes in over a century.
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