Denmark cyclists allowed to turn right at red lights

. . wrote:

Have I read this right?   They made red-light turns legal, but that only increased those doing it by 30%?   Either the Danes are a rebellious bunch, or awareness of the trial was very poor.

Or maybe the other 70% treated a red light as a "give way" and because there was cross traffic (i.e. in the lane that they might otherwise have turned into), they gave way?

Pete B wrote:

In general I think it would be a good idea to introduce this in the UK. However perhaps stating the obvious cyclists would still have to ensure it is safe to turn left through the red light. So if turning left in effect treating the Red light as a “Give Way” sign and not just take is as they can completely ignore the light and carry on at speed regardless of the light been Green or Red.

In the USA all vehicles i.e including motor vehicles (with some exceptions) are allowed to turn right through Red , unless there is a sign saying otherwise. A friend was going straight on through a traffic light cross roads (on Green), a car turning right through Red went into the side of her ! 

I think with the widespread use of sensor controlled lights that ignore cyclists, it would be reasonable to make the law "cyclists treat red lights as a stop sign" ie come to a complete stop assess if the way is clear and then proceed. Would also stop cyclist getting squished by left turning lorries.

It is not clear how the cyclist in the report proceeded through the junction, whether they endangered a pedestrian or why this was not a standard fixed penalty offence.

It is notable that careless driving resulting in death of a cyclist seems to carry an £80 fine, while cycling through a red light with no collision at all attracts a £220 fine.

Pete B wrote:

In general I think it would be a good idea to introduce this in the UK. However perhaps stating the obvious cyclists would still have to ensure it is safe to turn left through the red light. So if turning left in effect treating the Red light as a “Give Way” sign and not just take is as they can completely ignore the light and carry on at speed regardless of the light been Green or Red.

In the USA all vehicles i.e including motor vehicles (with some exceptions) are allowed to turn right through Red , unless there is a sign saying otherwise. A friend was going straight on through a traffic light cross roads (on Green), a car turning right through Red went into the side of her ! 

Yup, if this gets introduced there will be (IMO) more incidents than there is with cyclists getting caught by left turning lorries.  As pointed out, even in the US where its been legal and even part of the driving test, there are still incidents, now imagine what it would be like with drivers here who would not be expecting it.

This rule is only to benefit cyclists to allow them to get to the destination quicker, its not any safer (it reduces one risk while adding another).  Indeed if cyclists can do it why not allow cars to do it too, there is no reason why one could and another cant.

I honestly dont see the need to create bastardisations of rules when the alternatives already exist if there is a need for them, i.e. if you want to allow unrestricted left turn at a junction, just build it like that.  The one in the picture is already a separate lane, just put it on the other side of the light so its not under the control of the red.  Its easy and it doesnt build complications of the fact the new rules only apply in some places indicated probably by a tiny sign not everyone will understand or be aware of. 

Face it, left on red will only ever be allowed where you turn from a cycle lane into another cycle lane, with no risk of putting a cyclist into the path of another road user who may not know to expect you (see tiny signs comment).

STATO wrote:

I honestly dont see the need to create bastardisations of rules when the alternatives already exist if there is a need for them, i.e. if you want to allow unrestricted left turn at a junction, just build it like that.  The one in the picture is already a separate lane, just put it on the other side of the light so its not under the control of the red.  Its easy and it doesnt build complications of the fact the new rules only apply in some places indicated probably by a tiny sign not everyone will understand or be aware of. 

Face it, left on red will only ever be allowed where you turn from a cycle lane into another cycle lane, with no risk of putting a cyclist into the path of another road user who may not know to expect you (see tiny signs comment).

It'd be a lot quicker just to allow cyclists to turn left on red (also go the wrong way up one-way streets) rather than re-design every junction in the UK.